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21 points
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Where Are They Now? is an ongoing blog series dedicated to analyzing specific high-profile Lego sets that have been targeted for investment and sold out / retired a year or more in the past. The idea is to review and summarize a wide range of investment factors surrounding the set a few months before, during, and after it stopped becoming available at retail prices... then look at the financial performance of the set thus far, and perhaps discover a clue about future growth and/or similar sets yet to retire. I absolutely have to begin with the Lego exclusive set that blew the doors off the investment world in Fall of 2014: Town Hall. Released: March 2012 Last Available (US): October 2014 Months Availabile: 31 Retail Price (US): $199.99 Pieces: 2766 Minifigures: 8 A Little History The modular building series, starting in 2007 with Cafe Corner, quickly became extremely popular with both AFOLs and investors, rivaling Star Wars UCS as the well known "Top of the Line" Lego sets. Those first two buildings, including Green Grocer, were only available for a little over 2 years each which helps explain their astronomical appreciation. However, by the time late 2014 arrived, a pattern had obviously been established in most investor's minds that the rest of the series was sticking around approximately 4 years per set. Fire Brigade had departed in late 2013 after 4 years, Grand Emporium was several months past its 4th anniversary (and expected to retire), and Pet Shop had been available for 3.5 already. Virtually no one had Town Hall on their radar as a candidate for retirement at the time. A few savvy individuals opened their eyes in Spring 2014 when it went temporarily out of stock, but the vast majority were non-believers and focused their attention and wallets elsewhere. Popular Opinion This modular series centerpiece was also a poor seller in comparison to its brethren as it sat "gathering dust" on store shelves. Partial evidence of this fact was observed by many (including yours truly) that seal codes on these boxes were commonly a year or more old, while others in the modular series had been produced only a few months or even weeks prior to being offered at retail. Apparently Town Hall just wasn't selling. Take a look at the date stamps on posts 6 and 7 in the official Brickpicker thread to see how ignored this set was. Several possible reasons for the lack of popularity, especially as an investment, include: The $200 (US) price point - significantly higher than the other modular options available at the time. A large box that takes up significantly more space than other modulars. An arguably "ugly orange" / "boring" design, with less aesthetic appeal than many would like. Clear expectation that it would be available for at least another year. Now, Pay Attention... On Oct 1, 2014 Town Hall went to backordered status at LEGO Shop at Home, then Toys'R'Us online went out of stock. The next day, Target sold out, and Lego status when to Sold Out as well, followed by Walmart (all according to reports made in our Town Hall thread). Eyebrows were officially raised, especially given the then-recent quick disappearance of Haunted House, when many expected that set to stay widely available through Halloween. But still a large number of investors thought it was unwarranted panic, citing the double VIP point promotion as well as the in-and-out of stock "dance" that Grand Emporium had been doing for much of the year without actually retiring. That's when our illustrious troll-guru leader Ed Mack dropped an atom bomb disguised as a feather, on page 7: "Very soon, this will be the busiest thread on the site." Part Nostradamus classic, perhaps part self-fulfilling prophecy, this statement became more than true and the thread exploded over the next few days as investors and end users everywhere slowly but surely realized the huge ugly orange wedding chapel was actually going away... and maybe... just maybe... they wanted one (or several) after all. Last available on Oct. 4 from Lego US / Canada, occasional small batches of stock popped up at various retailers, both online and physical, for over a month... but you had to be very lucky or a truly dedicated soul (wearing out your F5 key or weaving scripting magic) to catch one of these opportunities. There was a final production run in weeks 38-39, corresponding to late September, that trickled out (primarily to resellers) during October. It seemingly was not too extensive, however. Show Me the Money! Meanwhile, eBay prices shot up into the $300-$350 range within a day.The Brickpicker Price Guide reflected this huge surprise retirement factor as New 10224 values reached $400 before Christmas and climbed steadily to the $530 range in Spring of 2015, before leveling off for several months. Some investors were happy to buy in at over 2x MSRP, predicting continued growth in late 2015, which simply hasn't happened. Still, the set currently shows a 25% CAGR, outstanding by almost any measure. New prices have seemingly stabilized around $550 on Amazon, $500 on eBay, and $450 on Bricklink for the time being. Brick Classifieds currently follows suit. A substantial increase in Used values occurred on eBay (U.S.) from around $250 to $400 late last summer, continuing up to $450 now. It should be noted that the rest of the eBay world seems to have an approximate 20% premium on New over Used sets, a much wider gap than the U.S., and certainly closer to "normal". However, average Used sales over the last six months are $400 on Bricklink as well, proving strong demand for opened Town Halls. Perhaps end users hit their financial limit later this year, choosing to accept pre-owned copies at nearly half the price instead... so many doing so, in fact, that buying competition drove the Used price up to nearly New values. Another factor could be that this set is quite difficult to piece together, reportedly commanding about $500 for all pieces and instructions (no box), before adding multiple shipping and handling charges. Do we assume New prices will begin the inevitable climb upward again soon? Or will Used values dip back down a bit first as Americans realize the relatively small difference right now? One would think the gap should widen again, one way or another. From a longer-term perspective, will there be another huge increase in Town Hall values at some point in the next year or two? Or will it simply rise steadily, seeking four-digit sales (then returns) closer to 2020? No one can say for sure, but it IS going to gain value again. The only questions are how fast and how far. Several seasoned investors believe this is one of a very small number of "special" sets released in the past few years that have the potential to reach the $1000 mark. Some optimists were even hoping it would approach that threshold in late 2015. The one wild card in the game which could completely invalidate such bullish predictions is the possibility of a remake. I certainly don't see that happening, but I doubt anyone could have guessed over a year ago that Winter Toy Shop would be remade, either. If Lego ever decided to duplicate Town Hall, the value of 10224 would obviously drop like a rock. What to Do with Mine? If you are holding and can afford it, my personal advice is to keep holding. The relatively low supply of this set compared to so many other exclusives should make it an even bigger winner in the long run. Simply out-waiting sellers who are happy to take 3x their buy-in is a path to more profit for the rest of us. As more and more of these get bought and opened, a sealed Town Hall will become more of a collector's item, vaguely similar to Cafe Corner and Green Grocer before it. Of course it will never catch those sets in value, but it is a virtual lock for the "bronze medal" of modular building investments. On the other hand, if you are a buyer who missed out... seriously consider looking for a current "deal" (whether new or used), and get yours soon. It is only a matter of time before this set keeps rising in value, and if there is another big jump, you will avoid several hundred dollars of regret by acting now. I believe we are in a temporary "lull" with Town Hall's value (especially New), and if so, the more buyers that take advantage of it, the sooner the lull will be over, financially benefiting those who do. I definitely do not recommend picking up this set at current prices as a pure investment anymore, however, as fresher and more predictable opportunities are widely available. The Big Picture: Above all, realize - if you don't already - that Town Hall in many ways kicked off the maelstrom of CHAOS representing a marked change in Lego retirement (and production) schedules. Many investors "learned their lesson" when caught empty-handed with(out) this set, and adjusted their strategies to accumulate target stock numbers on subsequent exclusives earlier and more gradually. Of course, some were doing this already, and happen to have been proven smarter in this particular case. One only need glance at Pet Shop, Death Star, Tower Bridge, and T1 Camper Van to see that a strategy which works best for one set may not work for others, however. Whatever your budget and investment angle, use the retirement of Town Hall as a reminder that anything can happen, and that when the truly unexpected occurs, historical gains may be had. Additionally, avoiding the herd/horde mentality is proving to be more and more of a wise choice, starting most noticeably in the months prior to the day of infamy when 10224 became the busiest thread on the site! Special thanks to the following individuals for suggestions and editing help: jaisonline7 points
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Here is a quick guide for smooshing (feeling) the new 71011 CMF Series 15 packs. Smooshing is a term used by Lego fans for feeling the CMF packs' hidden contents to determine which minifigure is inside it. You should be able to identify each minifigure by feeling for the 1st accessory on the list below. The other accessories can be used for back-up identification purposes. Farmer: round hat, pitchfork, pig Astronaut: visor (like a big fingernail), oxygen tank Frightening Knight: ball with soft spikes, shield, bucket helmet Clumsy Guy: crutches Tribal Woman: feather head piece (like a V), baby basket (like a loaf of bread) Flying Warrior: spear (stick with sharp point), wing pieces Faun: curved leg piece, head piece with horns and long ears Animal Control: net (kind of like thimble), skunk Janitor: long stick with a bump toward 1 end, mop head (hard wavy mushroom shape), cap Ballerina: wavy flat circular piece, hair piece with bun Laser Mech: jagged sword piece, armor Kendo Fighter: two swords, helmet with weird curves Shark Suit Guy: shark shaped head piece, flipper arms Wrestling Champion: trophy, hair piece with mullet Jewel Thief: grappling hook, gun piece Queen: puffy skirt (about the size of 2 stacked 2x4 bricks, cannot miss ) View full blog article5 points
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Where Are They Now? is an ongoing blog series dedicated to analyzing specific high-profile Lego sets that have been targeted for investment and sold out / retired a year or more in the past. The idea is to review and summarize a wide range of investment factors surrounding the set a few months before, during, and after it stopped becoming available at retail prices... then look at the financial performance of the set thus far, and perhaps discover a clue about future growth and/or similar sets yet to retire. I absolutely have to begin with the Lego exclusive set that blew the doors off the investment world in Fall of 2014: Town Hall. Released: March 2012 Last Available (US): October 2014 Months Availabile: 31 Retail Price (US): $199.99 Pieces: 2766 Minifigures: 8 A Little History The modular building series, starting in 2007 with Cafe Corner, quickly became extremely popular with both AFOLs and investors, rivaling Star Wars UCS as the well known "Top of the Line" Lego sets. Those first two buildings, including Green Grocer, were only available for a little over 2 years each which helps explain their astronomical appreciation. However, by the time late 2014 arrived, a pattern had obviously been established in most investor's minds that the rest of the series was sticking around approximately 4 years per set. Fire Brigade had departed in late 2013 after 4 years, Grand Emporium was several months past its 4th anniversary (and expected to retire), and Pet Shop had been available for 3.5 already. Virtually no one had Town Hall on their radar as a candidate for retirement at the time. A few savvy individuals opened their eyes in Spring 2014 when it went temporarily out of stock, but the vast majority were non-believers and focused their attention and wallets elsewhere. Popular Opinion This modular series centerpiece was also a poor seller in comparison to its brethren as it sat "gathering dust" on store shelves. Partial evidence of this fact was observed by many (including yours truly) that seal codes on these boxes were commonly a year or more old, while others in the modular series had been produced only a few months or even weeks prior to being offered at retail. Apparently Town Hall just wasn't selling. Take a look at the date stamps on posts 6 and 7 in the official Brickpicker thread to see how ignored this set was. Several possible reasons for the lack of popularity, especially as an investment, include: The $200 (US) price point - significantly higher than the other modular options available at the time. A large box that takes up significantly more space than other modulars. An arguably "ugly orange" / "boring" design, with less aesthetic appeal than many would like. Clear expectation that it would be available for at least another year. Now, Pay Attention... On Oct 1, 2014 Town Hall went to backordered status at LEGO Shop at Home, then Toys'R'Us online went out of stock. The next day, Target sold out, and Lego status when to Sold Out as well, followed by Walmart (all according to reports made in our Town Hall thread). Eyebrows were officially raised, especially given the then-recent quick disappearance of Haunted House, when many expected that set to stay widely available through Halloween. But still a large number of investors thought it was unwarranted panic, citing the double VIP point promotion as well as the in-and-out of stock "dance" that Grand Emporium had been doing for much of the year without actually retiring. That's when our illustrious troll-guru leader Ed Mack dropped an atom bomb disguised as a feather, on page 7: "Very soon, this will be the busiest thread on the site." Part Nostradamus classic, perhaps part self-fulfilling prophecy, this statement became more than true and the thread exploded over the next few days as investors and end users everywhere slowly but surely realized the huge ugly orange wedding chapel was actually going away... and maybe... just maybe... they wanted one (or several) after all. Last available on Oct. 4 from Lego US / Canada, occasional small batches of stock popped up at various retailers, both online and physical, for over a month... but you had to be very lucky or a truly dedicated soul (wearing out your F5 key or weaving scripting magic) to catch one of these opportunities. There was a final production run in weeks 38-39, corresponding to late September, that trickled out (primarily to resellers) during October. It seemingly was not too extensive, however. Show Me the Money! Meanwhile, eBay prices shot up into the $300-$350 range within a day.The Brickpicker Price Guide reflected this huge surprise retirement factor as New 10224 values reached $400 before Christmas and climbed steadily to the $530 range in Spring of 2015, before leveling off for several months. Some investors were happy to buy in at over 2x MSRP, predicting continued growth in late 2015, which simply hasn't happened. Still, the set currently shows a 25% CAGR, outstanding by almost any measure. New prices have seemingly stabilized around $550 on Amazon, $500 on eBay, and $450 on Bricklink for the time being. Brick Classifieds currently follows suit. A substantial increase in Used values occurred on eBay (U.S.) from around $250 to $400 late last summer, continuing up to $450 now. It should be noted that the rest of the eBay world seems to have an approximate 20% premium on New over Used sets, a much wider gap than the U.S., and certainly closer to "normal". However, average Used sales over the last six months are $400 on Bricklink as well, proving strong demand for opened Town Halls. Perhaps end users hit their financial limit later this year, choosing to accept pre-owned copies at nearly half the price instead... so many doing so, in fact, that buying competition drove the Used price up to nearly New values. Another factor could be that this set is quite difficult to piece together, reportedly commanding about $500 for all pieces and instructions (no box), before adding multiple shipping and handling charges. Do we assume New prices will begin the inevitable climb upward again soon? Or will Used values dip back down a bit first as Americans realize the relatively small difference right now? One would think the gap should widen again, one way or another. From a longer-term perspective, will there be another huge increase in Town Hall values at some point in the next year or two? Or will it simply rise steadily, seeking four-digit sales (then returns) closer to 2020? No one can say for sure, but it IS going to gain value again. The only questions are how fast and how far. Several seasoned investors believe this is one of a very small number of "special" sets released in the past few years that have the potential to reach the $1000 mark. Some optimists were even hoping it would approach that threshold in late 2015. The one wild card in the game which could completely invalidate such bullish predictions is the possibility of a remake. I certainly don't see that happening, but I doubt anyone could have guessed over a year ago that Winter Toy Shop would be remade, either. If Lego ever decided to duplicate Town Hall, the value of 10224 would obviously drop like a rock. What to Do with Mine? If you are holding and can afford it, my personal advice is to keep holding. The relatively low supply of this set compared to so many other exclusives should make it an even bigger winner in the long run. Simply out-waiting sellers who are happy to take 3x their buy-in is a path to more profit for the rest of us. As more and more of these get bought and opened, a sealed Town Hall will become more of a collector's item, vaguely similar to Cafe Corner and Green Grocer before it. Of course it will never catch those sets in value, but it is a virtual lock for the "bronze medal" of modular building investments. On the other hand, if you are a buyer who missed out... seriously consider looking for a current "deal" (whether new or used), and get yours soon. It is only a matter of time before this set keeps rising in value, and if there is another big jump, you will avoid several hundred dollars of regret by acting now. I believe we are in a temporary "lull" with Town Hall's value (especially New), and if so, the more buyers that take advantage of it, the sooner the lull will be over, financially benefiting those who do. I definitely do not recommend picking up this set at current prices as a pure investment anymore, however, as fresher and more predictable opportunities are widely available. The Big Picture: Above all, realize - if you don't already - that Town Hall in many ways kicked off the maelstrom of CHAOS representing a marked change in Lego retirement (and production) schedules. Many investors "learned their lesson" when caught empty-handed with(out) this set, and adjusted their strategies to accumulate target stock numbers on subsequent exclusives earlier and more gradually. Of course, some were doing this already, and happen to have been proven smarter in this particular case. One only need glance at Pet Shop, Death Star, Tower Bridge, and T1 Camper Van to see that a strategy which works best for one set may not work for others, however. Whatever your budget and investment angle, use the retirement of Town Hall as a reminder that anything can happen, and that when the truly unexpected occurs, historical gains may be had. Additionally, avoiding the herd/horde mentality is proving to be more and more of a wise choice, starting most noticeably in the months prior to the day of infamy when 10224 became the busiest thread on the site! Special thanks to the following individuals for suggestions and editing help: jaisonline View full blog article5 points
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5 points
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The only problem with this set is that this is an investment site and the set is still available for retail cost long after many of us bought it at clearance pricing thinking it was going away. This is a wonderful set. The figures are outstanding, the exclusive figures are amazing and it has the main heroes. If this thing had dispersed with the rest of the line it would be $200 by now. The problem with this thinking is we believe there are way too many out there to be consumed by the market. However if you were just looking at the quality of this set say 3 years from now, someone will be very, very interested in it. Sometimes we worry too much about current availability versus future desirability and quality. I feel this way about Benny's spaceship as well. There appear to be way too many of them available for below retail right now, but that might not matter 3 years from now when someone looks at the set and is very impressed by it. I'd rather put my money behind a quality set and know that I need to wait 3 to 4 years to cash in versus buying something that disappeared quickly, and had mainly perceived scarcity as a selling point.5 points
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5 points
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Brickpickers, I need 6 more easy-peasy likes. Page 15 of this forum! Or just like this post, doesn't matter4 points
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If you're not doing this with a sorting tray you're doing it wrong.4 points
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Dear .... We apologize for the delays and cancellation of some of your orders. But we have good news: Due to high demand and some complaints from bulk buyers, we have decided to extend the life of this popular set for another year. Our new batch is expected to arrive in March.. Blah blah....4 points
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FWIW, this request was denied earlier in the thread. Besides, wouldn't this give late purchasers an unfair advantage?4 points
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I made the "mistake" of buying the Scrambler and now I just need to have all of the Amusement Park themed sets, especially the Ferris Wheel, it's just an impressive display.4 points
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Got a very lego week this week ;-) Me and my wife booked a trip to legoland billund with the kids in may :-) Also in the process of being trained as a lego serious play facilitator. Spent the whole day playing with them brickies. Might not be a very usefull post but sometimes you just want to share the excitement. Have a good one!3 points
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This is the idea I think: (Copyright Swapmeetdave, reference purposes only, picture will be deleted upon first request) These gigantic machines, towering several hundreds of feet into the sky, are mainly to be found in Germany. Their purpose is to dig coals. In another hobby, urban exploration, I love to go and visit stuff like that.3 points
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3 points
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Or with an apron with 16 pockets.3 points
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Yep - but I love the excavator for the sheer unapologetic meat-headed way that it looks. Brutal! My christmas present to myself last year was the MK2 Crane. I suspect that's this year's christmas sorted.3 points
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70741 Ninjago Airjitzu Cole Flyer for $9.99 Yes, that's RRP. But there's a piece in there that's exclusive to that set, and one other set - the 2015 SDCC Tatooine Minibuild. I can't seem to find anyone selling that one part. So, the kids get the Flyer, with a part replaced.3 points
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3 points
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Sure. Donate $500.00 and I will tell you. [emoji12]3 points
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3 points
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You could spend $215 on a Tumbler at Walmart and have $45 left over. Wait 6-9 months, sell the Tumbler for a profit $75 or so (hypothetically), and purchase a Tower of Orthanc for $290 (hypothetically). That's $215 investment + 75 profit = $290 ... plus the $45 in your pocket.3 points
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For personal build, buy now since price will only go up. For investment, you could take that $260 and get Ewoks Village at retail on Amazon and benefit from its full appreciation post retirement instead of missing some of ToO's appreciation already. Just a suggestion, fwiw.3 points
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It was available for only 16 months. Then gone forever. It's a $200 UCS exclusive representing a timeless franchise (Batman). It's a vehicle. It has exclusive minifigures. Even with massive hoarding for a solid month by every Tom, **** and Harry during the midst of the "Lego Investing is Better Than Gold" hype, it has shot up to 50% above RRP in two weeks since becoming virtually extinct at retail. And the new Batman movie comes out in two months. Yeah, I'm sure it's going to flop any day now...3 points
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I can sum it up really quickly: 1. See sets on CL listed for retail price but are now 4+ years retired and worth 6-10x original price 2. Move on to next listings end tutorial3 points
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Brick Bounty for $48 at Kmart after signing up for 50% off first buy with CC and $5 coupon.3 points
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3 points
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Brickset posted the following description about this City Summer 2016 set: Sounds similar to the Winter Village Market, with a lot of little minibuilds. Honestly, I love the idea of some "civilian" sets (outside of the Creator line). This is a winner to me.2 points
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You're taking a sorting tray to the store?2 points
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Does anyone know when these sets will hit? I'm in for the Porsche...and the tractor, but I can't see that tractor right now, all I see is Porsche Porsche Porsche. I'm sure I'm in the minority, but I hope it's available as shown rather than a different color. I bet it's just LEGO trying to be clever though and it will most likely be a color. I hope it's something unique if it has to be a color, GT3 RS style like baby blue, bright orange or lime.2 points
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I think a full scale Parliament building with Big Ben included would be a more interesting choice.2 points
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Me and my youngest daughter picked up a 41095 Friends Emma's house. It was on sale on Walmart.com and the store here priced matched it at 59.99 so we were able to save a few bucks. It will be a fun build for the next few nights. She is in love with the Friends and shows little interest in the Elves. She doesn't say why just meh on themmight go back and pick up the remaining Cinderella's castle 41055 due to them being on sale for a few bucks off. I don't see them around very much anymore. They had 4 left.2 points
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DAAAAMMMMNNN! This is a real set?!? I thought it was a MOC at first. I might have to go back to school to get an engineering degree to build this SOB.2 points
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If I was LEGO, I would sell those plates that make up the Porsche body in different colors as add on packs. Lets say $40 per bag/box, each containing just the plates in 1 color. Maybe metallic grey, gunmetal grey, hot red, and metallic dark blue.2 points
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because anyone who follows cars, knows that cars are revealed in stages, and camo is used to mask against spy photos before the official reveal. real car guys will get it and eat it up. would love to have them release the sticker sheet as an alternate add on option, to put over the standard pieces.2 points
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Amazing.... Hopefully one of these days Canada will get a CN Tower/Skydome combo2 points
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2 points
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While these sets are already officially retired, many can still be found for around MSRP. Here in Europe the Birds set is scarce and therefore has seen already a decent price increase. But in the US it's supposedly still widely found. This set pretty much flew under the radar of many investors, and only after it retired in Europe and the value went up people realised it. But as often said: Europe and the US/Canada are different markets and not every set behaves the same post-EOL in these two separated markets. Rapunzel's Tower and Heartlake Shopping Mall could still be found for around MSRP. Remains to be seen how these sets will develop in the coming years. My daughter likes Rapunzel's Tower and has one to play with. But I don't have any as an investment as I don't believe in the current Friends / Disney line as an investment series. City Arctic sets will probably do nice after a while. Arctic Explorers is a nice sub-theme in the City theme. Don't expect spectacular increases though. But one or two sets in this theme could be a hidden gem in the works... Brick Bounty is a pirate ship, and every single Lego pirate ship has done well in the past. On the other hand, the BB is not a really iconic ship and also discounted by Lego when it was close to EOL. In the long run (10 years, as you mentioned) this should do okay but for the same money invested there may be other sets that will offer a faster return. The mentioned Star Wars sets will do well for now, especially the ISD and the AT-AT. But Star Wars sets also run the highest risk of remakes. Even more so now Disney owns the Star Wars brand and Disney is all about milking their IPs down to the last drop. Of the newer sets you mentioned, there's a chance Poe's X-Wing may get replaced by the upcoming new X-Wing (75149) coming out this Summer which is more or less the same X-Wing but with different colours, different minifigs and a different setting. If that happens, then Poe's X-Wing might become a highly desired and collectable set. All speculation though. The Ewok Village has a good chance to go retired this year. If you can get it at a good discount it ought to be worth it if you are patient enough to let it (slowly) increase in value post-retirement. I doubt it will be a fast riser like the Tumbler or the Red Five. Regarding the Ghostbusters HQ and the Brick Bank, they have just been released and will be available for a long time yet. If you want to buy them for yourself (to build) through Lego LEGO Shop at Home, wait for a double VIP promo to get more discount on them. For both it's too early to already buy them as investment because they will tie up your money while you're waiting for them to go retired in 2018/2019, maybe.2 points
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Decide what? If you're ready to join the masses who can't decide if "investing" is really for them? Or if they're just a QFLL? I'm sorry but I'm so tired of reading these posts... "If it's not looking good enough, I'll just return them." You should have left them where you found them then.2 points
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2 points