LEGO Bans - Open Discussion

[TheBrickClique]

As for operating with a single account to stay within the vendor’s technically-enforced limits, I believe this is the current state of things.
 

Cliff notes: you’ll be fine as long as you don’t go on a spending spree at Target.com, and try not to bring attention to your buying patterns by dealing with online customer service for small gripes that can be dealt with in store instead.

Target - the easiest place to get banned based simply on purchase volume online and the most aggressive against resellers in store — employees trained to identify resellers loading up carts for example.  Can still use red card in store after online ban, but using with a new email account will result in repeat ban — start receiving auto cancellations and email about possible issues including payment purchase method.  Some people have bans lifted after a period in timeout. Others indefinitely. The amount of purchases that may identify you as a reseller and get a ban? One data point: I have been unable to purchase online going on 18 months now after two months of $5k purchases on the red card. Same red card still works fine in store.
 

LEGO shop at home — with the purchase limits mechanics implemented a few years ago, it is much more difficult to get the SAH ban hammer. If you exceed a limit on any item based on past purchases of the same item, they will cancel your entire order. Be warned that if they cancel an order with a VIP Rewards purchase, the reward is not automatically credited back to your account. Also, if they cancel an item due to inventory issues, the system still tracks it as qty purchased. Qty purchased in brick and mortar stores that are purchased with VIP accounts are not counted towards SAH limits and and limits in store are done at the individual store’s discretion. If you do have to call customer service to resolve an issue, they do have easy visibility to all of your previous orders and will make comments about you “really liking LEGOs”.  No indication that that is how the ban process starts, but unless you really have an issue that needs CS, might be best to just let the small things go. 
 

Amazon — shop away. Their limits are tracked to the second on a 168-hour FIFO.  Limits apply and are tracked in that window only to items sold and shipped by Amazon.com. Buy as many third party items as you wish. Anecdotal stories of bans for excessive returns, but no clear information on the metrics used. Generally, probably best to save the returns for the really bad boxes.  Creating multiple accounts will get noticed and is the quickest way to get the warning shot emails. 
 

Barnes and Noble — similar to LEGO, has a five qty per item lifetime limit online. Exceed that amount and just that item will be cancelled from the order. No reports of bans. In store purchases do not appear to be tied to online memberships as far as adding to your 5-count quantity.  
 

Walmart — most LEGO are limited to two per order, but they won’t say how often that limit is reset.  Doing a couple of multiple limit orders in the same day has worked.  Doing dozens has resulted in order cancellations of those specific items but no bans that I am aware of. Generally, I have found one limit order per day has never resulted in a cancellation. 
 

ShopDisney — some items have limits but they are selectively enforced. If you put in multiple limit orders at the same time, they might cancel those items. If you space them out, they will be fine. I ordered a dozen castles (limit one per customer) last year and they all went through. Sometimes two in two consecutive days. 
 

Costco — has item limits on some items, but I haven’t seen any on LEGOs. Even with items with limits, possible to space them out without issue.  In store limits are usually “per day”. 
 

Best Buy — unsure on LEGO as I’ve never pushed the limits on them. In the past, I would make 50 purchases at a time of 2-dollar items that had limits and they would all go through.  I have tried to make multiple purchases of Xbox consoles and those were cancelled.  So YMMV. But no reports of bans.

Anyways, those are my observations.

[biking_tiger]

Welp, surprisingly it finally happened. Got the ban hammer from LEGO Shop at Home last night. 

I don't consider myself a big time investor, and i really don't purchase all that much from LEGO Shop at Home, so it's a bit of a surprise really. I got the reseller scum e-mail last night, and i'm not even going to bother fighting it because it is true after-all haha.

My last 5 purchases for anyone interested spread out over 2 month were:

May 14 - $8 worth of PAB pieces.

Jul 5 - 1x T-Rex Tracker(still backordered) and $13 worth of PAB pieces.

July 13 - Death Star (first ever purchased from LEGO Shop at Home during the call to check frenzy).

July 15 - Ferrari.

July 20 - Indom rex - boom banhammer!

Never purchased stupid massive amounts of anything, but oh well. I won't be losing sleep over it as my partners' account is still live (checked this am, orders are not getting cancelled). I have $20 in VIP to burn on my main account and i'll stop by my local store on the way home one day and use em (from what I've heard they are still usable in store, if not then i'm glad i never adopted the "hoard all VIP points forever" strategy :P).

I'm not going to claim myself innocent either, i'm sure there was something that flagged my account, i just don't know what it was to warn others about it or not make the same mistake on my partners' account.

Anyways just figured i'd share my experience!

Pretty damn shocking. Nothing here which looks very "reseller" to me. Anyone?

[Jules_K]

Was your username at Lego SAH the same as a Bricklink or Ebay username?

[Ryan Junior]

Are these bans happening in some countries and not others 

[Alucard1982]

Was your username at Lego SAH the same as a Bricklink or Ebay username?

Glad to see that LEGO is catching on, I've done the precautions...

[minicoopers11]

Welp, surprisingly it finally happened. Got the ban hammer from LEGO Shop at Home last night. 

I don't consider myself a big time investor, and i really don't purchase all that much from LEGO Shop at Home, so it's a bit of a surprise really. I got the reseller scum e-mail last night, and i'm not even going to bother fighting it because it is true after-all haha.

My last 5 purchases for anyone interested spread out over 2 month were:

May 14 - $8 worth of PAB pieces.

Jul 5 - 1x T-Rex Tracker(still backordered) and $13 worth of PAB pieces.

July 13 - Death Star (first ever purchased from LEGO Shop at Home during the call to check frenzy).

July 15 - Ferrari.

July 20 - Indom rex - boom banhammer!

Never purchased stupid massive amounts of anything, but oh well. I won't be losing sleep over it as my partners' account is still live (checked this am, orders are not getting cancelled). I have $20 in VIP to burn on my main account and i'll stop by my local store on the way home one day and use em (from what I've heard they are still usable in store, if not then i'm glad i never adopted the "hoard all VIP points forever" strategy :P).

I'm not going to claim myself innocent either, i'm sure there was something that flagged my account, i just don't know what it was to warn others about it or not make the same mistake on my partners' account.

Anyways just figured i'd share my experience!

Welcome to the club! You're fine with your VIP. You can still collect and use in store.

[Sandwraith]

Was your username at Lego SAH the same as a Bricklink or Ebay username?

Ebay account name is different, but Bricklink account is the same. However i'm not a seller on Bricklink (if they even bother to distinguish seller vs buyer).

[minicoopers11]

Pretty damn shocking. Nothing here which looks very "reseller" to me. Anyone?

My guess is that the "investigation" goes back further than that. Quick listing of clearance items bought on SAH, followed by the Lego ban team linking selling accounts with the SAH account can lead to a ban. 

[boxofcorey]

My guess is that the "investigation" goes back further than that. Quick listing of clearance items bought on SAH, followed by the Lego ban team linking selling accounts with the SAH account can lead to a ban. 

100%. No way this is a quick process for them, I'd assume a lot of their "investigation" sits in a queue for some length of time unless you set off a major red flag.

[tunnelvision]

Welp, surprisingly it finally happened. Got the ban hammer from LEGO Shop at Home last night. 

I don't consider myself a big time investor, and i really don't purchase all that much from LEGO Shop at Home, so it's a bit of a surprise really. I got the reseller scum e-mail last night, and i'm not even going to bother fighting it because it is true after-all haha.

My last 5 purchases for anyone interested spread out over 2 month were:

May 14 - $8 worth of PAB pieces.

Jul 5 - 1x T-Rex Tracker(still backordered) and $13 worth of PAB pieces.

July 13 - Death Star (first ever purchased from LEGO Shop at Home during the call to check frenzy).

July 15 - Ferrari.

July 20 - Indom rex - boom banhammer!

Did you get the limit of each of these sets that you purchased? 

[Grynn]

Very interesting stories, nothing new other than the geography it seems.

 

No discipline? You could get banned (and should, imho)

Lots of discipline? You could get banned.

Sandwraithe, were there any buying patterns in your previous history that would tip them off? The orders you listed are obviously not the kind that point to reselling whatsoever.

 

 

[Miami Bomb Squad]

Must be past history and some other things that accumulated.
Judging from those 5 purchases, Everyone here would have been banned already.  

[Sandwraith]

Did you get the limit of each of these sets that you purchased? 

Of those listed in my post no not at all. I have definitely hit my maxes on other sets though, never in 1 purchase though, never in 1 month either. My inventory is under $10,000, and off the top of my head i have 3 or less of each modular/exclusive, so i certainly don't have a mountain of sets and constantly hitting LEGO Shop at Home limits.

 

Sandwraithe, were there any buying patterns in your previous history that would tip them off? The orders you listed are obviously not the kind that point to reselling whatsoever.

I'm sure if anyone went over any of our accounts with a fine tooth comb it would scream "re-seller"  It could have been all the purchases from double VIP this year, but i'm sure tons of people go ham during then (my version of going ham would still be spending under $1000). Maybe i was just an unlucky one flagged for a random "audit" or something.

Edited July 21, 2015 by Sandwraithx157

[trekgate502]

Of those listed in my post no not at all. I have definitely hit my maxes on other sets though, never in 1 purchase though, never in 1 month either. My inventory is under $10,000, and off the top of my head i have 3 or less of each modular/exclusive, so i certainly don't have a mountain of sets and constantly hitting LEGO Shop at Home limits.

I'm sure if anyone went over any of our accounts with a fine tooth comb it would scream "re-seller"  It could have been all the purchases from double VIP this year, but i'm sure tons of people go ham during then (my version of going ham would still be spending under $1000). Maybe i was just an unlucky one flagged for a random "audit" or something.

My sympathy sir

Seriously

[tonysbricks]

This is very strange and concerning :| How long ago was the last "reseller" purchase you made that was at a limit?

[mudcatsfan]

I think we just have to face the truth. 

Ed & Jeff are narc-ing us out to lego in order to get inside info on retirements.

Sad day, but what other explanation is there?

 

added by request.

Edited July 21, 2015 by mudcatsfan

[Darth_Raichu]

I think we just have to face the truth. 

Ed & Jeff are narc-ing us out to lego in order to get inside info on retirements.

Sad day, but what other explanation is there?

I was going to write a long essay to defend Ed & Jeff but I already moved 20+ posts to start my day and was not in the mood to do an encore here.. j/k (or was I?  )

I am pretty sure that was a joke, but some people (especially newbies) might perceive it differently.  Perhaps next time put a  at the end.

[Sandwraith]

This is very strange and concerning :| How long ago was the last "reseller" purchase you made that was at a limit?

Technically May 4th. I bought a UCS Tie for myself, and another R5 to hold. Putting my R5's at my limit of 2 from LEGO Shop at Home i believe. This doesn't seem like a flag to me, but who knows.

[fantomas007]

To be honest, its funny and stupid what TLG is doing. On one side, they are happy if you buy many items and send you invitation for some VIP purchase events. On the other side, if you buy too many sets, they will give you a ban. Very inteligent. Its like going to an electronics shop and buy TV, fridge, radio, etc, they are happy, but if you want 3x TV, they will not sell them to you. Can you imagine such situation? I cannot. I am from an ex-communist country, where you were not allowed to buy foreign gods, there were limitation for everything interesting and rare, many things were missing in the shops - and what TLG is doing with bans, purchase limits is very similar and is making me a bad reminiscences to the past. Where the hell is a logic for limiting purchases? What would normal company do in a case when many people is buying their products (from whatever reasons), is increasing the production. It doesnt matter what is the reason of buying many sets, if there is a strong secondary market, it is a signal that something is probably wrong with company´s policy - maybe they finish the production of sets too early, maybe they should make re-makes, etc. OK no problem if TLG want to change its production and replace old sets by new ones. But why they just not produce more sets, if they know, that there is strong demand from resellers?

Another story is their distribution policy. After giving a ban, they offer that you can be a official reseller. But there is another unlogic story behind it. Why they are limiting the official resellers what to buy and re-sell? Why i have to buy almost all their production, and cannot buy just exclusives? What the hell is this policy? Its like starting a new shop for sport clothing, and big factories will puch me to buy from them not only T-shirts and sport shoes, but also furry coats. Where is a logic??? I am almost sure that this policy is again the European Union law. You cannot limit resellers what to buy. Another break of law is that TLG is favoring their distribution net (SAH) - only SAH can sell some kind of sets, only SAH has VIP points system, only SAH can add to the orders special bonus sets / polybags, which giving SAH a competition advantage from other shops...

TLG policy is something which belongs to 19th century...

[meowsmeowsmeows]

Technically May 4th. I bought a UCS Tie for myself, and another R5 to hold. Putting my R5's at my limit of 2 from LEGO Shop at Home i believe. This doesn't seem like a flag to me, but who knows.

That's not a ridiculous purchase and disappointing to hear. Sorry to hear that as I've purchased the same over the past 7 months (2 Red 5's and the TIE on May 4th). 

[biking_tiger]

Clearly there's more afoot than purchases / limits, or, like others have said, we'd all be banned. 

Edited July 21, 2015 by biking_tiger

[No More Monkeys]

To be honest, its funny and stupid what TLG is doing. On one side, they are happy if you buy many items and send you invitation for some VIP purchase events. On the other side, if you buy too many sets, they will give you a ban. Very inteligent. Its like going to an electronics shop and buy TV, fridge, radio, etc, they are happy, but if you want 3x TV, they will not sell them to you. Can you imagine such situation? I cannot. I am from an ex-communist country, where you were not allowed to buy foreign gods, there were limitation for everything interesting and rare, many things were missing in the shops - and what TLG is doing with bans, purchase limits is very similar and is making me a bad reminiscences to the past. Where the hell is a logic for limiting purchases? What would normal company do in a case when many people is buying their products (from whatever reasons), is increasing the production. It doesnt matter what is the reason of buying many sets, if there is a strong secondary market, it is a signal that something is probably wrong with company´s policy - maybe they finish the production of sets too early, maybe they should make re-makes, etc. OK no problem if TLG want to change its production and replace old sets by new ones. But why they just not produce more sets, if they know, that there is strong demand from resellers?

Another story is their distribution policy. After giving a ban, they offer that you can be a official reseller. But there is another unlogic story behind it. Why they are limiting the official resellers what to buy and re-sell? Why i have to buy almost all their production, and cannot buy just exclusives? What the hell is this policy? Its like starting a new shop for sport clothing, and big factories will puch me to buy from them not only T-shirts and sport shoes, but also furry coats. Where is a logic??? I am almost sure that this policy is again the European Union law. You cannot limit resellers what to buy. Another break of law is that TLG is favoring their distribution net (SAH) - only SAH can sell some kind of sets, only SAH has VIP points system, only SAH can add to the orders special bonus sets / polybags, which giving SAH a competition advantage from other shops...

TLG policy is something which belongs to 19th century...

They are private company -  they can do what they want. They don't have government agency or activist shareholders telling them what to do. And they are #1 - #2 toy manufacturer now. Whatever they do, works for them

If they were publicly traded and were under board of directors, i could easily see us swimming in 10179s sold at every Walgreens.

[fantomas007]

They are private company -  they can do what they want. They don't have government agency or activist shareholders telling them what to do. And they are #1 - #2 toy manufacturer now. Whatever they do, works for them

If they were publicly traded and were under board of directors, i could easily see us swimming in 10179s sold at every Walgreens.

Not at all. Its general mistake that a private company can do anything. Can Samsung join Apple, if they wish? No, because they are some antimonopoly regulations, they need to get approval etc. Can an oil refinery sell oil to its distribution net with different prices in comparison with other distribution companies? No.

There are many regulations and law limiting the free trade. TLG and SAH are DIFFERENT entities from a legal point of view. And TLG cannot give better condition to SAH than other distributors.

[MarleyMoose]

Wow. seems kind of harsh if no limits were broken.

[Siddy]

To be honest, its funny and stupid what TLG is doing. On one side, they are happy if you buy many items and send you invitation for some VIP purchase events. On the other side, if you buy too many sets, they will give you a ban. Very inteligent. Its like going to an electronics shop and buy TV, fridge, radio, etc, they are happy, but if you want 3x TV, they will not sell them to you. Can you imagine such situation? I cannot. I am from an ex-communist country, where you were not allowed to buy foreign gods, there were limitation for everything interesting and rare, many things were missing in the shops - and what TLG is doing with bans, purchase limits is very similar and is making me a bad reminiscences to the past. Where the hell is a logic for limiting purchases? What would normal company do in a case when many people is buying their products (from whatever reasons), is increasing the production. It doesnt matter what is the reason of buying many sets, if there is a strong secondary market, it is a signal that something is probably wrong with company´s policy - maybe they finish the production of sets too early, maybe they should make re-makes, etc. OK no problem if TLG want to change its production and replace old sets by new ones. But why they just not produce more sets, if they know, that there is strong demand from resellers?

Another story is their distribution policy. After giving a ban, they offer that you can be a official reseller. But there is another unlogic story behind it. Why they are limiting the official resellers what to buy and re-sell? Why i have to buy almost all their production, and cannot buy just exclusives? What the hell is this policy? Its like starting a new shop for sport clothing, and big factories will puch me to buy from them not only T-shirts and sport shoes, but also furry coats. Where is a logic??? I am almost sure that this policy is again the European Union law. You cannot limit resellers what to buy. Another break of law is that TLG is favoring their distribution net (SAH) - only SAH can sell some kind of sets, only SAH has VIP points system, only SAH can add to the orders special bonus sets / polybags, which giving SAH a competition advantage from other shops...

TLG policy is something which belongs to 19th century...

OMG By the time the furry coats arrived I am rolling on the floor.  ROFL

Ahem...  goood argument, there. I totally agree.

[speedsausage]

Welp, surprisingly it finally happened. Got the ban hammer from LEGO Shop at Home last night. 

I don't consider myself a big time investor, and i really don't purchase all that much from LEGO Shop at Home, so it's a bit of a surprise really. I got the reseller scum e-mail last night, and i'm not even going to bother fighting it because it is true after-all haha.

My last 5 purchases for anyone interested spread out over 2 month were:

May 14 - $8 worth of PAB pieces.

Jul 5 - 1x T-Rex Tracker(still backordered) and $13 worth of PAB pieces.

July 13 - Death Star (first ever purchased from LEGO Shop at Home during the call to check frenzy).

July 15 - Ferrari.

July 20 - Indom rex - boom banhammer!

Never purchased stupid massive amounts of anything, but oh well. I won't be losing sleep over it as my partners' account is still live (checked this am, orders are not getting cancelled). I have $20 in VIP to burn on my main account and i'll stop by my local store on the way home one day and use em (from what I've heard they are still usable in store, if not then i'm glad i never adopted the "hoard all VIP points forever" strategy :P).

I'm not going to claim myself innocent either, i'm sure there was something that flagged my account, i just don't know what it was to warn others about it or not make the same mistake on my partners' account.

Anyways just figured i'd share my experience!

Sandwraith, that is seriously ridonkulousl! Like most have said I believe the same thing. No way it has to do with your purchase history you gave us, they must be looking further back than that. They obviously have a "ban team" that works specifically on this and they must be pulling data from multiple websites, piece it all together, come to a conclusion and make a decision. They could simply cross reference the info in the "what did you buy today" thread with purchases made the same day in their system and start narrowing it down that way. (I know it's not that simple but you guys get the idea). Anyways thanks for the heads up, it's hard not to puff your chest and share stock room pics, purchases made etc. but now I'm going to TRY to be a little more reserved in that regard.