LEGO S@H "Black Listing": Did you ever receive this re-sale warning from Shop at Home?

[Grolim]

TLG have their reasons and it will boil down to what they think is a profitable decision.  There are plenty of obvious reasons why this may be so that have been fleshed out in this thread already.  Throwing up counter-arguments for why it won't work or why it's unfair serve us no purpose here, the decision has already been made.  They would have considered all those anyway and the potential negatives must be far outweighed by the positives.  Plus you have to remember that these decisions are made at the macro level and just because they may not work for an individual situation or example, this has very little bearing on the global Lego empire which TLG is concerned with.

 

What we need to focus on is strategies for overcoming these new limitations, we've had a few of those brought up already.  There is also the positive aspects of the policy such as potentially limiting reseller volumes which in turn can only improve the value of your brickfolio.

[Diabolos80]

We can debate what is this or that (but for the record I agree that there is no difference between investor or reseller) but here's the bottom line for Lego. Sure the "reseller" will affect current market with current product. But the "investor" actually has the same or more chance of affecting Lego because of the fact they are supposedly ONLY selling retired sets and here's why. In the here and now market, the reseller actually has to work harder and faces more competition not only from Lego but all the other big box stores and other resellers and they're all fighting for the same dollar because the customer can go a million places and find it. In those situations Lego's odds are better because they have the inventory and pricing to sway a customer their way and/or they at least move a current unit because it went to a retailer where it was sold. The way I see it, the investor stands more chance of hurting them because now a customer may be making a choice not between pricing or loyalty to a store but between the old version or the new version of set and that means NONE of the stores that offer the current set stand a chance if that customer decides to go with the older set. In this scenario, Lego loses out completely because it hasn't been able to sell anything through it's curent channels.

I think I disagree for a couple reasons. First, maybe we've agreed that the secondary Lego market is pretty small. And Lego and Amazon or Target or TRU got paid the first time the set sold. Next, the market can obviously sustain eol sales, which have risen parallel to retail sales. And last, worrying about 75 sales a month on a 2 year old toy is a big ask of the world's top toy producer. They're far too busy designing the next Republic Gunship

Reselling current sets creates two tensions, one, you're making money Amazon wants, and for some reason that pisses off corporations. And 2, you're bloating the price of fhe toy. That pisses off Lego because they have principles. It's their property, not physically but intelectually, and they've priced it accordingly, because they want a brand with good value and a fitting reputation.

Unfortunately, Lego doesn't know whether you're gonna keep those Funhouses for 6 years or 6 days. Right now, the best they can do is control the supply. If they decide to interact with the secondary side of things, buying retail sets will be the least of your worries.

[spener90]

And I appreciate quite a bit, from quite a few people here as well, including you. I just feel like there's an element here that's very disrespectful at times, and the net result for me has often been a form of self-induced frustration, rather than a feeling that I'm actually helping anyone.

 

I think as a community BP will have to make some decisions. Two that come to mind are 1) Do we want to be 911 for everyone who doesn't understand eBay jumps in (vs. being willingto be helpful before people get involved, which I think is the right place to be), and 2) Should all the random whining that adds no value be allowed to continue?...I'm referring specifically to the threads we see complaining about TRU, eBay, PayPal, etc...

We will miss you if you do leave.  I have always enjoyed conversing/debating about sets, selling, and strategies with you.  I see what you are saying about the site having a lot of people jumping in and asking for generic advice right off of the bat (ex: I have $500, what sets should I buy?), sorry if that offends anyone, but if you need our advice on it, you might want to take a step back...

 

More on the topic of Lego banning.  I believe it is a foolish move by them.  I support limits, as it helps make sure that there aren't an overwhelming amount of sets collecting dust on shelves.  But I feel in many ways they are missing out on a huge opportunity.  I know they don't want to become Beanie Babies, but as someone else said, they also almost became Lincoln Logs.  If it almost happened once, it can happen again.

 

Final advice to Lego: Careful what you wish for, it might just get you.

[willy431]

Now that chima, galaxy squad and lone ranger look to be flops...they have plenty of unused capacity. Why not crank up the presses and prerelease green grocer and cafe corner? If they rerelease those and Harry potter sets....I will be first in line with a couple grand to buy these sets...as would others. What is really to stop them? Nothing. Do they want to be a collectable--or dominate the young boy toy segment? With increasing the minecraft run of 10k...and the 5 year death star run..they don't seem to care much about exclusivity and residual value.

Give the real consumers what they want lego. We want cafe corners and green grocers. Make them yourself or leave the resellers alone.

[Diabolos80]

Here is real example I want Harry potter. all of them. Well...my son does. If I can't get them from resellers...I am not going to the lego store to get him lone ranger. Just because I want eol hp sets doesn't mean mean I will settle for a chima. In this case why would lego care if I pay 200 for a castle set on eBay. My son will get it..everyone Will be happy...son will get hooked on lego..and ask for NEW lego sets....then I will buy retail sets.What I really don't understand is take the funhouse. They are cranking them out for 40 bucks a unit..costs them 15 @ the most. Lots of time no stock at lego stores I go to. Why in the heck don't they just flood the market with them? These are diamonds, oil or currency where you don't want to flood the market..in fears of lowering future sales prices. Why would they care? If the market want millions of these things...and you are doubling your money each time you sell one...then why stop? To protect the resale market from crashing? Interesting discussion. Lego marketing is reason this thread..perhaps on of them will go rogue and chime in?

  

I have confidence in LEGO that they will not flood the market.  They like inflated prices for their products.  Reminds me of Harley Davidson Motorcycles several years back.  Harley Davidson is very protective of its brand as well and made it difficult to buy a new bike a few years ago. The values of the bikes remained high as did their appeal.  Then HD decided to produce more bikes and the company profits suffered, as did their reputation.

I think you're both right. Lego wants a brand with good perceived value, which means they want people to get a good deal out the door and then feel even better, later on, when it's sold out at Target, or it's eol, or it's too expensive for your friend to buy it on ebay It's a collectible, and collectibles thrive on mystique. Limited lifespans, limited resellers, and limited supply create mystique. Lego is limiting access to its product in order to preserve its brand. Why else would it sell its own product at higher prices than its closest competitor? Amazon moves BULK, Lego moves reputation. And you're not able or allowed to take either.

As for what to do to get around it, emes already said it, and well. Effective advice for those moving at his level, because it applies to several other ventures. In the Lego market, though, we say this is not a get rich quick trial. It's difficult to sustain a Lego-only model at a large volume, because Amazon sells it cheaper and there's not enough leftover bulk. As for exclusives, well. Maybe that's why the Funhouse started this conversation. If Lego won't allow Amazon to sell it, what makes you think you deserve the right? This actually brings up an interesting question: are there specific sets that set off alarms, or influence an auditer?

[Anakinisvader]

Its not about the money....

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=km0_vOE_2XE

[What_does_the_future_hold]

Wow. It sums up their side. Sums up our side. I say we close the thread!

[Alcarin]

You might have misunderstood me. I'm not saying any such thing, nor am I saying that I have any great wisdom that you need. I never said there should be a "special" forum for anyone, and I certainly wouldn't participate in it if there was one...I said the community has to decide what kind of community it wants to be.

 

For the record, I don't know how you'd vet who gets to be in the "special" forum, so the idea is DOA to me.

 

But your reply is exactly what bothers me about this site. You haven't taken the time to comprehend what I'm actually saying.

 

There is an old Chinese proverb that basically says "give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day, teach a man to fish, and you feed him for a lifetime."

 

With few exceptions, when people have asked me things on this site it has been of the "give me a fish" variety. In other words, I've been asked "tell me what product to buy and where to buy it and when to sell it", along with a host of other questions that I likely don't know the specific answers to. That's basically begging and it's not what I want to do nor do I want to encourage it. 

 

I'd rather be on not only the teaching people to fish side of things, but also like to learn from others what they know about fishing. There are a lot of guys here who know a ton of stuff, and I've definitely benefitted. Their voices are often overwhelmed by those who know very little.

 

It's a simple choice regarding the type of community I want to be a part of, and I'm not saying I'm better than you or that I have some great wealth of knowledge that you need, and that I'm going to withhold it from you.

 

 

Hey emes whenever I hear this proverb I add something to it and it might be worth thinking on it

 

 

"give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day, teach a man to fish, and you feed him for a lifetime, instead sell him the fish"

 

 

 

 

[legoman12323123]

To many idiots on this forum .. one thing they dont understand is once lego starts re releasing old sets because they have done well after EOL is a very stupid business decision. For Example in the last 3 days I have sent over $3,000 (prob close to 100k this year) on lego soon to retire sets in anticipation for huge returns, if lego started to re release old popular sets I would never buy lego in mass quantity again. I am sure lego does not care about you piss poor losers who complain about the high cost of legos because they value investors/resellers more than the average person who buys maybe 2-4 lego sets a year. I just purchased more legos in 2 days for the purpose of investing them a average person would ever spend on legos in a lifetime. Once lego stops caring about their AFOLS and investors with big bank rolls and starts screwing us over there goes 20% of legos profits which amounts to millions just to make a cheap poor scrub like Willy happy.

[legoman12323123]

Another thing to consider is Lego does not flood the market with millions of sets because once that happens those sets will lose all value. Think about it if lego released millions of sets and they supply was 10x higher than the demand the market would be flooded with legos and only way to get rid of them would be to clearance them which would destroy the value of lego collectibles. For Example Baseball Cards are worthless complete junk .. they got greedy flooded the market with these cards and now they are piece of crap useless and I wouldnt even buy a pack of baseball cards for even .25 cents.

[legoman12323123]

I think Willy431 just angry he invested all his money into Galaxy Squad Legos because it was on clearance and now living on the streets

[Alcarin]

Man iketart you stole how fast i received some negative reputation... 5 posts and already -6 thats almost worthy of an user award if someone asks me.

[stephen_rockefeller]

I think Willy431 just angry he invested all his money into Galaxy Squad Legos because it was on clearance and now living on the streets

consider this your one and only warning, the next post you make attacking a member or calling anyone an idiot you will be banned.....that behavior will not be tolerated period. You have been warned.

[pickleboy]

There was a forum post started about this article but I think it is relevant here as well.  It is time to quit thinking of LEGo as strictly a toy company. (Still their main business but they do a lot more.)  They have shows, videos games, theme parks...sound familiar?  My guess is, LEGO is more worried about their brand then anything else.

http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/advisor/build-brand-content-empire-learn-lego-131516058.html

[Guest eightbrick]

I think Willy431 just angry he invested all his money into Galaxy Squad Legos because it was on clearance and now living on the streets

Willy can get under people's skins sometimes but that was uncalled for, and people are going to turn on you real fast if you call them idiots. Stephen isn't joking, you will be banned pretty quick talking like that, so please, if you won't hear it from a mod, hear it from another member - calm down.

 

Back on topic, did anyone sift through the super-long brickset thread similar to this where respected member LFT got baned from LEGO Shop at Home?

[Ed Mack]

To many idiots on this forum .. one thing they dont understand is once lego starts re releasing old sets because they have done well after EOL is a very stupid business decision. For Example in the last 3 days I have sent over $3,000 (prob close to 100k this year) on lego soon to retire sets in anticipation for huge returns, if lego started to re release old popular sets I would never buy lego in mass quantity again. I am sure lego does not care about you piss poor losers who complain about the high cost of legos because they value investors/resellers more than the average person who buys maybe 2-4 lego sets a year. I just purchased more legos in 2 days for the purpose of investing them a average person would ever spend on legos in a lifetime. Once lego stops caring about their AFOLS and investors with big bank rolls and starts screwing us over there goes 20% of legos profits which amounts to millions just to make a cheap poor scrub like Willy happy.

If you include yourself in this description, then I certainly agree.  I can see your time on this site will be limited.  Oh, by the way, you are the first person to earn the TROLL AWARD. 

[legoman12323123]

Do I also get a prize with that?

[legoman12323123]

Sorta confused why willy431 is allowed to bash people hate and QQ all day long, I say 1 thing and now I am going to get banned .. errr

[stephen_rockefeller]

Sorta confused why willy431 is allowed to bash people hate and QQ all day long, I say 1 thing and now I am going to get banned .. errr

You can be confused all you want........feel free to create your own site and you can make your own rules and share all your infinite so eloquently phrased wisdom.

[Ed Mack]

Now that chima, galaxy squad and lone ranger look to be flops...they have plenty of unused capacity. Why not crank up the presses and prerelease green grocer and cafe corner? If they rerelease those and Harry potter sets....I will be first in line with a couple grand to buy these sets...as would others. What is really to stop them? Nothing. Do they want to be a collectable--or dominate the young boy toy segment? With increasing the minecraft run of 10k...and the 5 year death star run..they don't seem to care much about exclusivity and residual value.

Give the real consumers what they want lego. We want cafe corners and green grocers. Make them yourself or leave the resellers alone.

If you re-release sets, the old sets will lose value.  If this becomes commonplace and people know that LEGO will remake popular sets, the retired sets will not increase in value.  How rare will they be?  Not rare at all.  You will destroy the LEGO secondary market if every set is remade.  The only reason a collectible increases in value(besides metals) is the rarity of the item.  Not rare...not valuable.

[StarCityBrickCompany]

If you include yourself in this description, then I certainly agree.  I can see your time on this site will be limited.  Oh, by the way, you are the first person to earn the TROLL AWARD. 

 

I think the Troll is a bit too cute - You may start having users trying to get one as a badge of honor.

[Ed Mack]

Sorta confused why willy431 is allowed to bash people hate and QQ all day long, I say 1 thing and now I am going to get banned .. errr

Willy was warned weeks ago and now you have been as well.  By the way, you said about 3 things that were uncalled for.  Insulting people will not make your point come across any better.  You are an amateur troll.  Quality trolls know how to insult people without them knowing it.  

[Alcarin]

If you re-release sets, the old sets will lose value.  If this becomes commonplace and people know that LEGO will remake popular sets, the retired sets will not increase in value.  How rare will they be?  Not rare at all.  You will destroy the LEGO secondary market if every set is remade.  The only reason a collectible increases in value(besides metals) is the rarity of the item.  Not rare...not valuable.

 

What I would like to discuss at some point is. Would not that be better for all of us overall

 

I think both sides of this discussion (potential one) could have pros and cons.

 

I personally could care less if secondary market COMPLETELY crashes (read GG re-release and similar especially the non-licensed sets remakes all over the place)

 

I am a FAN of LEGO first investor second, and personally have no remorse for those who are investors in LEGO first (or only) and fans second.

[legoman12323123]

Willy was warned weeks ago and now you have been as well.  By the way, you said about 3 things that were uncalled for.  Insulting people will not make your point come across any better.  You are an amateur troll.  Quality trolls know how to insult people without them knowing it.  

 

Well I am new to the forums and from the kind of remarks willy431 was saying I figured this sort of thing was allowed. Thanks for informing me this behavior is not tolerated. Also Thank you for the Troll title it suits me well <3

[Diabolos80]

To many idiots on this forum .. one thing they dont understand is once lego starts re releasing old sets because they have done well after EOL is a very stupid business decision. For Example in the last 3 days I have sent over $3,000 (prob close to 100k this year) on lego soon to retire sets in anticipation for huge returns, if lego started to re release old popular sets I would never buy lego in mass quantity again. I am sure lego does not care about you piss poor losers who complain about the high cost of legos because they value investors/resellers more than the average person who buys maybe 2-4 lego sets a year. I just purchased more legos in 2 days for the purpose of investing them a average person would ever spend on legos in a lifetime. Once lego stops caring about their AFOLS and investors with big bank rolls and starts screwing us over there goes 20% of legos profits which amounts to millions just to make a cheap poor scrub like Willy happy.

Oh my gawd dude are you for real? Please tell me you're a physics professor just having fun on too many cups of coffee There's no way you're a genuine human being, this has to be an act, right? Please? I mean, there are just too many outlandishly ridiculous things going on in this one post for this to be anything but staged. I don't think I've ever been called an idiot in such idiotic terms. And so much irony! I don't see how a real person of this intelligence could possibly hold a job worthy of the pay required to support your stated buying practices. And you're so wrong about so many, many things! Honestly, I'm really really glad you showed up today. I hope you don't get banned too quickly, you're a lot of fun. Keep up the good work!