COVID-19 / Coronavirus Discussion

[NIevo]

3 hours ago, KvHulk said:

On a lighter note... our local restaurants are getting pretty inventive the past 2 weeks... Our local pizzeria has been delivering pizza kits for parents and children to make their own mini pies... drink specials for the parents... All sorts of out of the ordinary specials.

That's actually a pretty good idea!

4 hours ago, BricksBrotha said:

This certainly triggers me b/c you are so caught upon name calling you still fail to recognize he was over a month or two even, late, @NIevo.

Jan. 22: “We have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China.”

As the coronavirus spread in China and the first US case was reported by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) on January 21. Trump was asked during an interview with CNBC on January 22 if he had any worries about the situation escalating into a pandemic. He said he did not.Trump made this comment on the CNBC show “Squawk Box” during an interview with Joe Kernen at the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland. At the time, there were 500 cases reported in China and the first had just been recorded in the United States.

Feb. 2: “We pretty much shut it down coming in from China. It’s going to be fine.”

Trump made this comment on the Fox News program “Hannity.” A few days prior to this interview, the Trump administration suspended entry to the United States of only foreign nationals who had recently visited China (excluding Hong Kong and Macau).

This is around the date (Feb 2nd) we should have and could have reacted. Exchange students, families, vacationers, business, etc. all had already traveled home, spreading the virus.  I understand being patriotic and defending our president.  This one is defenseless in the terms of humanity.  Repeated lies that will eventually result in deaths is no president of mine.  Unbelievable people stand up for someone who would in turn kick them to the curb in a second.

I hate talking politics but unfortunately a crewed nepotist business person muscled his way into Politics (facts no name calling) and his decisions are effecting our lives more than ever. As recently as Mar7th, the POTUS was telling reporters he was 'not concerned' about Covid-19's spread b/c 'we've done a great job'. Instead of treating Covid-19 more seriously, he actually made it a point to down play it.

 This isn't a discussion or even an argument, these are actual events. His administration is clearly acting in a way that has slowed down our response, EXPONENTIALLY!

Lol...yeah, I figured it would hit your type.  Take a deep breath your gonna give yourself an aneurism.

[Alpinemaps]

This certainly triggers me b/c you are so caught upon name calling you still fail to recognize he was over a month or two even, late, [mention=81033]NIevo[/mention]

I’m trying to follow your logic. So if the President was a month or two late, does that make the EU a month or two, plus 4 days late?

Here’s where I think you are looking for conflict where none has to exist. I don’t see Nlevo denying the response time. Instead, I see the hypocrisy of EU countries saying one thing, and then backtracking days later. I see Nlevo calling that out.

It feels like you’re the one getting caught up here. Ignoring that all governments didn’t react as quickly as we (in hindsight) would have liked them to act.

[KvHulk]

I think everyone is strategically ignoring what they want to, to further their own arguments. Let me go find a link that bolster's my opinion, brb!.

[SpaceFan9]

If wisdom is to be gained through a multitude of council, I place this here for one to ponder... 

Blain, "Reasons to be hopeful": https://morningporridge.com/the-morning-porridge/f/blains-morning-porridge---march-25-2020---reasons-to-be-hopeful

He lists "dueling" Oxford studies, an earlier one forecasting doom and a more recent one forecasting calm.  The rosy outlook depends on the actual timing of start of spread.  That is, if the spread started earlier than was detected, we are probably farther along the curve then we think.

I knew a professor once that often said: "all models are bad.  some are useful."  That appears to be true in spades, here.

[BricksBrotha]

1 hour ago, NIevo said:

Lol...yeah, I figured it would hit your type.  Take a deep breath your gonna give yourself an aneurism.

Probably very easy to say from where you are sitting, the lack of empathy is oozing from your collective banter. 

 

1 hour ago, Alpinemaps said:

I’m trying to follow your logic. So if the President was a month or two late, does that make the EU a month or two, plus 4 days late?

Here’s where I think you are looking for conflict where none has to exist. I don’t see Nlevo denying the response time. Instead, I see the hypocrisy of EU countries saying one thing, and then backtracking days later. I see Nlevo calling that out.

It feels like you’re the one getting caught up here. Ignoring that all governments didn’t react as quickly as we (in hindsight) would have liked them to act.

 

Not sure about the EU, I dont think any of their leaders are spewing nonsense on twitter for the world to see. 

My logic is Nlevo is proud when POTUS closed the border and comparing the dates to EU as a "Who is right?'.   Thats a child's argument and one should be left for the playground.  Compared to me being ashamed of his timing when he knew about this as early as Jan21 and refused to mobilize.  

 

To stand by and be ok with our response as a nation is very dangerous and irresponsible. 

When people try to refute logic, deny facts or bend truths, an argument will arise 100% of the time.

 

 

Edited March 25, 2020 by BricksBrotha
typos

[elmaslıefendi]

[fuzzy_bricks]

19 minutes ago, BricksBrotha said:

Probably very easy to say from where you are sitting, the lack of empathy is oozing from your collective banter.

Not sure about the EU, I dont think any of their leaders are spewing nonsense on twitter for the world to see. 

My logic is Nlevo is proud when POTUS closed the border and comparing the dates to EU as a "Who is right?'.   Thats a child's argument and one should be left for the playground.  Compared to me being ashamed of his timing when he knew about this as early as Jan21 and refused to mobilize. 

To stand by and be ok with our response as a nation is very dangerous and irresponsible. 

When people try to refute logic, deny facts or bend truths, an argument will arise 100% of the time.

What would have been an appropriate, or optimal, response and when?  I'm not asking as a gotcha question, I'm legitimately curious what you would have liked to see done.

[BricksBrotha]

I am by no means an epidemiologist, but it is common consensus when dealing with community transmission, social measures need to be implemented sooner, the better.  We wasted ALL of February!  And some of the things said during this time frame by our POTUS should be criminal, quite frankly.  He was and continues to be completely reckless and has caused way more harm to the economy and peoples lives then some people want to acknowledge.

I am pointing this out, because we need to learn from this historical event.  In the grand scheme of things, money can and will be replaced.     

 

[lodibricks]

Honestly, I feel like it's a lose-lose situation. Right now, we're doing the "hindsight 20/20" where we see how we should have handled it, but if we took these measures a month ago, people would be screaming even more how much of an overreaction we're making, especially when it was zero-to-few confirmed cases in US at the time. Half the country will always be upset with choices made, one way or the other.

[Alpinemaps]

I’m quarantining myself from this thread, lol.

[NIevo]

35 minutes ago, BricksBrotha said:

I am by no means an epidemiologist, but it is common consensus when dealing with community transmission, social measures need to be implemented sooner, the better.  We wasted ALL of February!  And some of the things said during this time frame by our POTUS should be criminal, quite frankly.  He was and continues to be completely reckless and has caused way more harm to the economy and peoples lives then some people want to acknowledge.

I am pointing this out, because we need to learn from this historical event.  In the grand scheme of things, money can and will be replaced.     

 

So what was Obama's response to H1N1?

[CosmicSpeed]

25 minutes ago, NIevo said:

So what was Obama's response to H1N1?

Please, let me know what Jefferson's response would have been to the Civil War.

 

We are where we are and nothing we can do can change why we are here now. Pointing fingers certainly isn't. So many people try and quickly play the blame game rather than trying to find a way out of this together.

 

Response was either too overblown, not fast enough, too little-too late, shoulda woulda coulda.

 

What about right now? What can we do right. Now.

Edited March 25, 2020 by CosmicSpeed
added words and edited spelling

[KvHulk]

Ah, The ever popular WWOD argument...

Edited March 25, 2020 by KvHulk

[Alpinemaps]

Ah, The ever popular WWOD argument...

Ah, the famous “I’m going to ignore what my guy did, even though it was a similar response and doesn’t fit my narrative of being overly critical of the current guy I don’t like because my guy is one political party and it’s not the one I like.”

Seriously sick of it. Why can’t BOTH be wrong? Or both be right? Or maybe we just finally acknowledge they’re all the same?

I’m seriously checking out of this thread now.

[KvHulk]

My guy? I have a guy? It's the same reply to everything "If Obama... blah blah blah..."

Edited March 25, 2020 by KvHulk
Added; Checking out too. have a great day!

[fuzzy_bricks]

Where you guys have "shelter in place" orders, are they being enforced those through fines or jail time?  I assume you can still go out for essential services and recreate outside as long as you maintain proper social distancing?  One semi-local to me was put into place so I was just curious how it compares.

[exciter1]

14 minutes ago, fuzzy_bricks said:

Where you guys have "shelter in place" orders, are they being enforced those through fines or jail time?  I assume you can still go out for essential services and recreate outside as long as you maintain proper social distancing?  One semi-local to me was put into place so I was just curious how it compares.

Pretty much stuff is closed, what isn't, be courteous, keep your distance, business as usual.

[iahawks550]

19 minutes ago, fuzzy_bricks said:

Where you guys have "shelter in place" orders, are they being enforced those through fines or jail time?  I assume you can still go out for essential services and recreate outside as long as you maintain proper social distancing?  One semi-local to me was put into place so I was just curious how it compares.

There is no teeth in any of this. Most of it is for the businesses to determine what is and isn't open.

[Phil B]

25 minutes ago, fuzzy_bricks said:

Where you guys have "shelter in place" orders, are they being enforced those through fines or jail time?  I assume you can still go out for essential services and recreate outside as long as you maintain proper social distancing?  One semi-local to me was put into place so I was just curious how it compares.

Here is Ohio's definition of "stay at home":

Can I leave my house during a stay-at-home order?

Yes, under specific circumstances. The exceptions that are included with the stay-at-home order include:

• If it's a matter of health and safety: This includes seeking emergency services, obtaining medical supplies or medication, or visiting a health care professional.
• For necessary supplies and services: To obtain groceries or food, household consumer products, supplies needed to work from home get auto supplies (including dealers, parts, repair and maintenance).
• For outdoor activity: These include walking, hiking, running or biking. Individuals may go to public parks and open recreation areas, however, playgrounds are closed.
• Certain types of work: To perform work providing essential products and services
• To take care of others: Including a family member, friend or pet in another household and to transport those as allowed by the order. This includes weddings and funerals. 

What is an essential business?

 

Essential businesses will continue to operate, though practicing social-distancing.

Those include (find the full list in the order attached at the bottom): 

• Health care and public health operations
• Stores that sell groceries and medicine
• Food, beverage and licensed marijuana production and agriculture
• Restaurants that offer carry-out or take-out
• Organizations that provide charitable and social services
• Religious entities
• Newspapers, TV, and radio organizations
• Gas stations and businesses needed for transportation
• Banks and insurance institutions 
• Hardware and supply stores
• Post offices and other businesses that provide shipping and delivery services
• Laundry services
• Educational institutions
• Hotels and motels

What is non-essential business?

The order states: All businesses and operations in the state that are not listed as "essential" are required to cease all activities, but may continue operations if employees are able to work from home.

How does the order define 'social distancing'?

Social distancing includes:

• Maintaining at least 6 feet from other individuals
• Washing hands with soap and water for at least 20 seconds as frequently as possible or using hand sanitizer
• Hand sanitizer and sanitizing products readily available
• Separate operating hours for vulnerable populations, such as implementing operating hours for elderly
• Online and remote access: Posting online whether a facility is open and how to reach the facility and continue services by phone or remotely

[Ed Mack]

Well I am so happy that 25 million was approved for the Kennedy Center in the bill.  😑

That money could have helped quite a few small businesses pay their employees and mortgage...As for the discussion above about essential businesses, I happen to own one and right now it's really tough.  We cut our staff in half and our business has dropped about 50%.  I guess I am lucky to be open, yet everyday I risk getting infected.  But I have no alternative.  I have to try and keep my employees with some sort of paycheck and my mortgage paid.  I have my doubts if we will see any help at all from this stimulus package.  

While I realize we have to flatten the curve, we also will have to slowly ramp up the economy and open up businesses in areas that can do it relatively safely.  

[Bold-Arrow]

Thanks @BrickLegacy for sharing this 

[NIevo]

1 hour ago, fuzzy_bricks said:

Where you guys have "shelter in place" orders, are they being enforced those through fines or jail time?  I assume you can still go out for essential services and recreate outside as long as you maintain proper social distancing?  One semi-local to me was put into place so I was just curious how it compares.

Nothing.  Police already said they aren't going to really enforce it just ask people to please use common sense and educate them.   It's a joke really.

[NIevo]

1 hour ago, CosmicSpeed said:

Please, let me know what Jefferson's response would have been to the Civil War.

 

We are where we are and nothing we can do can change why we are here now. Pointing fingers certainly isn't. So many people try and quickly play the blame game rather than trying to find a way out of this together.

 

Response was either too overblown, not fast enough, too little-too late, shoulda woulda coulda.

 

What about right now? What can we do right. Now.

This has nothing to do with who was President, he just happened to be in office.  Its more about the absolutely ridiculous actions being taken about this illness compared to H1N1.  

[MarleyMoose]

Same here. I live in a place where many well off people have their summer homes. Unfortunately since this has all begun the out of states plates are everywhere. My neighbor from NYC just got here 2 days ago to escape. Thanks Dana.. Nice to see you.

Edited March 25, 2020 by MarleyMoose
spelling der

[NIevo]

1 hour ago, KvHulk said:

Ah, The ever popular WWOD argument...

We know he would have just written a strongly worded letter but as I already stated is not about who was in office, more to do with the overall response.