LEGO PLUS+ Taj Mahal (feat. DUPLO) - DUPLO "Idea" succeeding THIS time?

[Frank Brickowski]

LEGO PLUS+ Taj Mahal (feat. DUPLO)
Built with easy-to-handle DUPLO bricks "LEGO PLUS+ Taj Mahal" is a "grown-up" display set dedicated to senior LEGO fans and/or visually/motorically impaired builders, and also suits everyone who likes big models but doesn't like to handle thousands of pieces.

https://ideas.lego.com/projects/7681a03b-8066-4313-9cf2-62ce667c1974

Maybe it's much more likely for THIS new submission (also by AFOD) to become the first ever DUPLO set to succeed on the LEGO Ideas platform, rather than the divisive "DUPLO Mysteries ot The White House" ( https://ideas.lego.com/projects/865fd7d2-ac55-4162-a098-80fa99d458cb ). Your thoughts on the DUPLO Taj Mahal and the new concept of "LEGO PLUS+" (adult sets built with DUPLO)?

[mauro23]

Really bad idea, sorry...

[brickvoyeur]

I think the design looks really good... but I don't think it will sell well enough to make it worth producing.

Duplo is for the youngest generation of builders. They want figures and characters that they relate to, with sets that have playability. Your vast majority of Duplo builders aren't looking to build it to admire. They build and destroy, then build something new.

[Frank Brickowski]

4 hours ago, mauro23 said:

Really bad idea, sorry...

Which one of the incorported ideas of the sumbmission do you mean exactly?

4 hours ago, brickvoyeur said:

I think the design looks really good... but I don't think it will sell well enough to make it worth producing.

Duplo is for the youngest generation of builders. They want figures and characters that they relate to, with sets that have playability. Your vast majority of Duplo builders aren't looking to build it to admire. They build and destroy, then build something new.

The set is designed to build for adults, not for kids. I fear many users will not really read the info given about the innovative purpose/concept of the submission...

[gregpj]

The set is designed to build for adults, not for kids. I fear many users will not really read the info given about the innovative purpose/concept of the submission...

This is a much better set than the White House set with much broader appeal (even to kids this set would have some appeal - its fancy) but I don't think LEGO will want to be "that innovative" with their first Duplo ideas set.

Almost all of the ideas sets have some some of AFOL component to them, I don't see them breaking with that tradition for this concept.

[thoroakenfelder]

11 minutes ago, gregpj said:

This is a much better set than the White House set with much broader appeal (even to kids this set would have some appeal - its fancy) but I don't think LEGO will want to be "that innovative" with their first Duplo ideas set.

Almost all of the ideas sets have some some of AFOL component to them, I don't see them breaking with that tradition for this concept.

How many 2-3 year old kids do you know that want a predominately white toy with zero play value? Parents and grandparents can get them cheaper sets with more colors and included figures. Most adults disdain Duplo for their own collections. I don't see any Duplo set as being practical for them to sell. Maybe I am wrong and maybe there's a large number of adults out there who want these large, awkward Duplo bricks. Kids however don't want world monuments. A small cross section of parents with money who think their baby is a genius might get it, but we're talking a population sample that more than likely isdiminished by those parents that only buy their children wood toys because they're more environmentally friendly.

[gregpj]

How many 2-3 year old kids do you know that want a predominately white toy with zero play value? Parents and grandparents can get them cheaper sets with more colors and included figures. Most adults disdain Duplo for their own collections. I don't see any Duplo set as being practical for them to sell. Maybe I am wrong and maybe there's a large number of adults out there who want these large, awkward Duplo bricks. Kids however don't want world monuments. A small cross section of parents with money who think their baby is a genius might get it, but we're talking a population sample that more than likely isdiminished by those parents that only buy their children wood toys because they're more environmentally friendly.

 

I said "some appeal" Compared to the White House set it's pretty fancy. I don't think any kids would care that it's a world monument, but kids just leaving the world of duplo are aware of castles and other fantasy world things (I know it's not a castle) and may find this cute.

 

After mom and dad build it, it would get destroyed and mixed with all the other bricks.

 

It does have some neat bricks kids can make ice cream cones with tho.

 

@ Frank .. And yes I realize kids aren't the target audience but duplo is for kids so I think LEGO would look at how it appeals to kids as well because they'd need those sales to be worthwhile. Even regular AFOL LEGO sets typically have appeal to kids... if you disagree I know a 7 and 10 year old who'd love to touch someone's new 75192.

[Frank Brickowski]

2 hours ago, gregpj said:

Almost all of the ideas sets have some some of AFOL component to them, I don't see them breaking with that tradition for this concept.

There wouldn't be any "breaking with tradition" because, as I hinted on already, the set IS for AFOLs.

2 hours ago, thoroakenfelder said:

How many 2-3 year old kids do you know that want a predominately white toy with zero play value? Parents and grandparents can get them cheaper sets with more colors and included figures. Most adults disdain Duplo for their own collections. I don't see any Duplo set as being practical for them to sell. Maybe I am wrong and maybe there's a large number of adults out there who want these large, awkward Duplo bricks. Kids however don't want world monuments. A small cross section of parents with money who think their baby is a genius might get it, but we're talking a population sample that more than likely isdiminished by those parents that only buy their children wood toys because they're more environmentally friendly.

This is an adult set. It's not intended for kids' play. That is the new idea of "LEGO PLUS+", hence the set is NOT called "DUPLO Tja Mahal" but "LEGO PLUS+ Taj Mahal". I repeat: it is not meant for kids. Over and out...

[Frank Brickowski]

1 hour ago, gregpj said:

 

I said "some appeal" Compared to the White House set it's pretty fancy. I don't think any kids would care that it's a world monument, but kids just leaving the world of duplo are aware of castles and other fantasy world things (I know it's not a castle) and may find this cute.

After mom and dad build it, it would get destroyed and mixed with all the other bricks.

It does have some neat bricks kids can make ice cream cones with tho.

@ Frank .. And yes I realize kids aren't the target audience but duplo is for kids so I think LEGO would look at how it appeals to kids as well because they'd need those sales to be worthwhile. Even regular AFOL LEGO sets typically have appeal to kids... if you disagree I know a 7 and 10 year old who'd love to touch someone's new 75192.

I might sound like a broken record here, but: The set is NOT for kids, but for adults. Wow, pretty difficult to get a new idea across if no one is reading the project description. Wait, in a nutshell it's in the cover picture already... hm... what else does it take?

[gregpj]

Just now, Frank Brickowski said:

I might sound like a broken record here, but: The set is NOT for kids, but for adults. Wow, pretty difficult to get a new idea across if no one is reading the project description. Wait, in a nutshell it's in the cover picture already... hm... what else does it take?

I read what you said and saw the words in the picture .. what I'm saying is Duplo has NEVER been for adults in any way shape or form (aside from paying for it and hoping their kids build what's pictured on the box).

What I'm saying is that I do not believe LEGO would consider this project UNLESS it has appeal to kids as well. It has some appeal, but I don't think has enough in either direction (kids or adults) for LEGO to consider it.

 

[Frank Brickowski]

44 minutes ago, gregpj said:

what I'm saying is Duplo has NEVER been for adults

The way you keep repeating this "fictionally forced connection", it sounds like this being some kind of "LEGO commandment". The new project is introducing the new idea of DUPLO now being VERY MUCH for adults. So, yes, you are right on the one hand: Duplo HAS never been for adults before (past). But with "LEGO PLUS+" it WOULD/WILL be for adults NOW (present/future).

To come up with something new that might not care at all about what has been once is called innovation to my knowledge. Meaning: it does not matter at all if Duplo "has never" been for adults. If the new idea is good and helps impaired and/or senior citizens - I don't see any problem in saying: Duplo IS for adults NOW. You just have to get rid of your mental connection between Duplo SETS and Duplo BRICKS. There might have been people saying: "Teflon is for Space Shuttles only and has NEVER been for non-stick pans". And then somebody came and said: Now it IS for pans, too. Where's the problem?

[gregpj]

Just now, Frank Brickowski said:

The way you keep repeating this "fictionally forced connection", it sounds like this being some kind of "LEGO commandment". The new project is introducing the new idea of DUPLO now being VERY MUCH for adults. So, yes, you are right on the one hand: Duplo HAS never been for adults before (past). But with "LEGO PLUS+" it WOULD/WILL be for adults NOW (present/future).

To come up with something new that might not care at all about what has been once is called innovation to my knowledge. Meaning: it does not matter at all if Duplo "has never" been for adults. If the new idea is good and helps impaired and/or senior citizens - I don't see any problem in saying: Duplo IS for adults NOW. You just have to get rid of your mental connection between Duplo SETS and Duplo BRICKS. There might have been people saying: "Teflon is for Space Shuttles only and has NEVER been for non-stick pans". And then somebody came and said: Now it IS for pans, too. Where's the problem?

Ok, here goes one last time. I get the purpose of the idea...

BUT I do not think LEGO would ever use Ideas as a platform to change how Duplo is seen in the market. I also don't see them going down this path of "Duplo+ is good for adults now" EVER because of how they view their product lines and how it makes them money.

It's not a fictionally forced connection .. it's the current reality.

PS You asked what people thought, I'm just giving you my take. 

PPS At first I thought your Teflon analogy was dumb, but I think it serves my point quite well after thinking about it. Aside from the fact Teflon was invented by accident, when it became financially feasible to expand beyond industrial and military purposes AND when that change meant someone could make money off of it, they changed how it was used and marketed. I said above, I don't think having only impaired or adults as the target for Duplo+ would generate enough sales for LEGO to consider it.

 

[Frank Brickowski]

1 minute ago, gregpj said:

 I don't think having only impaired or adults as the target for Duplo+ would generate enough sales for LEGO to consider it.

Statistical facts of the present - comparing the target groups of "Kids" vs. "Seniors":
- USA: more than 15 % of the population are 65+ while about 19 % are younger than 15 years
- European Union: more than 19 % of the population are 65+ while only about 16 % are younger than 15 years

As you can see, in the EU there are already more potential "LEGO PLUS+" buyers than there are potential DUPLO buyers - and the numbers above for "kids" are up to 15 years of age meaning the DUPLO audience is only a fraction of it (maybe someone can give more detailed numbers).

If DUPLO generates enough sales for LEGO to keep the line going for decades while the target group is shrinking, "LEGO PLUS+" for builders over 50 years could make them a fortune - especially regarding future demographics. If LEGO does not adjust its portfolio to changing demographics soon, they might be in trouble sooner than they think.

[gregpj]

13 minutes ago, Frank Brickowski said:

Statistical facts of the present - comparing the target groups of "Kids" vs. "Seniors":
- USA: more than 15 % of the population are 65+ while about 19 % are younger than 15 years
- European Union: more than 19 % of the population are 65+ while only about 16 % are younger than 15 years

As you can see, in the EU there are already more potential "LEGO PLUS+" buyers than there are potential DUPLO buyers - and the numbers above for "kids" are up to 15 years of age meaning the DUPLO audience is only a fraction of it (maybe someone can give more detailed numbers).

If DUPLO generates enough sales for LEGO to keep the line going for decades while the target group is shrinking, "LEGO PLUS+" for builders over 50 years could make them a fortune - especially regarding future demographics. If LEGO does not adjust its portfolio to changing demographics soon, they might be in trouble sooner than they think.

Just because the demographics of a population change, it doesn't mean your product becomes more desirable to any one group even to those that are growing. We're not talking about Depends here, we're talking about something that has been viewed as a TOY for 60 years.

Potential buyers does not equal actual buyers.

I just think it's too risky for a company with declining numbers. I know we're a small voice, but we are knowledgeable and many people around here are advocating for less products not more. At a time when LEGO needs to hunker down and be better at what they do, this is too risky and potentially very costly.

Seniors are typically on the lower end of disposable income as well .. LEGO isn't cheap and would be viewed as a luxury by many. Adult coloring books are a much cheaper, more popular option and with less "toy" connections.

[Salimr]

I do not know many seniors here that have tons of expendable income. When I worked for the department of agriculture we actually had many seniors who ate pet food as they could not afford real food.

I have read stats showing almost no one in the united has saved properly for retirement. I am not sure about the rest of the world.

I know all my experience with seniors as they would much rather save their money or spend it on family members children's lego sets than their own sets. They really seem to think of others much more than themselves.

My grandpa and his friends brag about how little they spend at bingo or dance night and laughed when I showed him this. He said if it cost more than his puzzles there was no way, but he is just one person.

I think there could be some interest at nursing homes like puzzle tables or for therapy, but just have never met any senior citizen who I could see spending what this would cost for themselves.

I really do like this though it is cool and I hope I'm wrong and it gets made and sells great!

[thoroakenfelder]

3 hours ago, Frank Brickowski said:

I might sound like a broken record here, but: The set is NOT for kids, but for adults. Wow, pretty difficult to get a new idea across if no one is reading the project description. Wait, in a nutshell it's in the cover picture already... hm... what else does it take?

Yes, you do keep saying that. However, you haven't produced any statistical evidence of adults purchasing for themselves or seniors even being interested in something that their great grand children are playing with for themselves. Much less, diving feet first into what has to be $150-$200 worth of plastic on a whim since they have had no prior inclination to purchasing Duplo. Statistics about age don't equate to statistics about who will actually purchase the product. Show me the LUG group that builds in only Duplo and I'll start to take you seriously since you have found the target audience.

[lodibricks]

I don't know if this is really worth a kid vs adult debate. Seniors are adults, but not all adults are seniors. This is focused on seniors. 
I always think of an old home having puzzles & applesauce. I'd take a DUPLO Taj over a puzzle.
The idea is somewhat neat, but like others have said, I can't see much for sales being pretty specific in its target (senior/physically-impaired).

[Frank Brickowski]

8 hours ago, gregpj said:

Seniors are typically on the lower end of disposable income as well .. LEGO isn't cheap and would be viewed as a luxury by many.

"Child Poverty: About 15 million children in the United States – 21% of all children – live in families with incomes below the federal poverty threshold."
http://www.nccp.org/topics/childpoverty.html

...which does NOT keep TLG from making a lot of money with DUPLO in the US as well. So I don't really see your "lower end of disposable income"-seniors keeping TLG away from making a lot of money with "LEGO PLUS+" as well.

[gregpj]

Le sigh.

[BricksBrotha]

11 hours ago, lodibricks said:

I don't know if this is really worth a kid vs adult debate. Seniors are adults, but not all adults are seniors. This is focused on seniors. 
I always think of an old home having puzzles & applesauce. I'd take a DUPLO Taj over a puzzle.
The idea is somewhat neat, but like others have said, I can't see much for sales being pretty specific in its target (senior/physically-impaired).

@lodibricks summed up my sentiment exactly after reading the ideas description @Frank Brickowski crafted and the discussion it generated.  The best case would probably be bulk orders of crafting boxes to nursing homes and retirement communities.

 

I get what @gregpj is saying about breaking tradition in the ideas platform, (the irony here tho it started as CUUSO & rules have changed so the platform has been altered before) however, what better way to tell tlg they have interest in a current product line for a new target audience? In a business equation, that equals a new revenue stream with very little upfront capital investment. 

 Do you honestly think if @Frank Brickowski peddled the votes to get to review, essentially dropping a 10k po, tlg would ignore it? 

[thoroakenfelder]

2 hours ago, BricksBrotha said:

@lodibricks Do you honestly think if @Frank Brickowski peddled the votes to get to review, essentially dropping a 10k po, tlg would ignore it? 

I've always assumed there's a pretty big margin for error on those votes. You have the Frank's that just vote for anything. You also have the people who dramatically undervalued the sets when they say they would buy them. That's why Lego asks how much you would pay and how many you would buy. If 5000 voters would only buy one if it were 30% or more below what their analytics day the set should cost, that's 50% not buying the set.

[donbee]

Two thoughts.

1) where did the creator get all that white Duplo? Must've been very expensive.

2) if they can get that blog lady that lit up the ginger bread house to write up a pseudo-scientific article about how duplo can be beneficial for the elderly,I.e.: arthritis-friendly, alzeheimers-preventative, choose-your-placebo, then this could actually sell. I could see one in every retirement home on the East coast of Florida.

This could be the must have Christmas gift for Granny. QFFL ftw!

 

[Frank Brickowski]

15 hours ago, donbee said:

Two thoughts.

1) where did the creator get all that white Duplo? Must've been very expensive.

2) if they can get that blog lady that lit up the ginger bread house to write up a pseudo-scientific article about how duplo can be beneficial for the elderly,I.e.: arthritis-friendly, alzeheimers-preventative, choose-your-placebo, then this could actually sell. I could see one in every retirement home on the East coast of Florida.

This could be the must have Christmas gift for Granny. QFFL ftw!

 

Who's that blog lady you mentioned? I must have missed that story.

And yes, getting all those white pieces surely cost a bit of money. The guy seems to be pretty "serious" with his take.

[donbee]

Who's that blog lady you mentioned? I must have missed that story.
And yes, getting all those white pieces surely cost a bit of money. The guy seems to be pretty "serious" with his take.

Read the most recent 5 pages of the gingerbread house thread. It's somewhere in there.

[Frank Brickowski]

On 16.9.2017 at 12:08 PM, gregpj said:

Le sigh.

While the Brickpicker.com forum is once again in its well-known "grumpy mode", user comments in other forums and on the project page are almost exclusively positive, with many people encouraging the truly innovative idea (the platform is called "IDEAS" by the way) of sets for impaired people using DUPLO bricks. Now, after only 4 days of being live, the Taj Mahal project has reached 1,000 views and 68 supporters.