STAR WARS VIII - "The Last Jedi" - Movie Discussion

[exracer327]

2 minutes ago, thoroakenfelder said:

If that's your qualification, Rogue One, the prequels and the forthcoming Solo all fail to do that as well.

I thought Rogue One did a better job of bringing stuff together.  Vader's scenes were well done.  Tarkin looked a little too CGI for my taste, but I thought the actor's performance was well played.

The most annoying thing for me in Rogue One is at the very end.  Tarkin orders the DS to target the base on Scarif.  So why does the blast go all the way out in the middle of the ocean?  Because it hit the dish on the top of the tower.  I'm sorry, Tarkin said to target the "base" not the "dish on the top of the tower at the base."  I guess Disney needed to have their hero shot at the end so we would know they all died.

[thoroakenfelder]

6 minutes ago, exracer327 said:

The most annoying thing for me in Rogue One is at the very end.  Tarkin orders the DS to target the base on Scarif.  So why does the blast go all the way out in the middle of the ocean?  Because it hit the dish on the top of the tower.  I'm sorry, Tarkin said to target the "base" not the "dish on the top of the tower at the base."  I guess Disney needed to have their hero shot at the end so we would know they all died.

I honestly thought that the Death Star missed but they figured close enough when I first saw it. I mean, precision shooting the dish is kind of a cool idea, but much less practical than just shooting the building.

Rogue One did a terrible job with characters, with story, and with transitions. Hell, the most common response I got to "What makes Rogue One so great?" was "The last 5 minutes." So ignoring the previous 2 hours of nonsense, 5 minutes of Darth Vader and a bad CG Leia make it better than everything else. Makes sense to me.

[Darth_Raichu]

27 minutes ago, exracer327 said:

Yep, that is the portion of the scene that really gets me too.  Apparently Leia is able to open a pressure door that had to have slammed shut when the atmosphere was lost, close the door again, re-pressurize the area, then open the air-lock door so the rest of the crew could get to her.  All while she's basically in a vacuum and with little to now "force abilities."  *sigh*

The other scene which really annoys me is how Rey ends up back on the Falcon after she and Kylo blow up Luke's lightsaber.  So somehow she was able to wake up, find both halves of Luke's lightsaber, ignore everyone else in the room (not kill Kylo,) get off the mega ship without being seen and Chewie is able to fly the Falcon (also unseen,) to the mega ship, land, pick Rey up - because she was so easy to find on a 25 KM long ship - and go into battle on Crait.  And how did they know to go to Crait?  I guess she and Leia have some sort of force connection now too?  *sigh*

This past weekend I watched the first time TV airing of TFA.  Although there are points where I roll my eyes (DS #3, trench run, trash compactor, etc...) it had more of a feel of a Star Wars movie than TLJ.  It may have pushed boundaries, but most issues were at least plausible in the SW universe.  (Although Poe killing 9 Tie Fighters in less than 30 seconds during the battle on Takodana).  TLJ kind of just threw every SW idea they had against the wall and whatever stuck, they went with and threw the rest away.

Keep in mind, Rian Johnson has been tapped by Disney for a brand new SW trilogy.  So apparently, they really like what he did.  But I'm not really seeing fans liking it, young or old.  I mean you know it's bad when even your 10 yr-old daughter complains about Leia's superman move in space.

You all think about this waaayy too hard.  The answer to most questions in TLJ is so simple: everyone who did seemingly impossible tasks is Force sensitive.  Think about it:
- How did Leia survived space? She was Force sensitive
- How did the broom moved to the kid at the end of the movie? He was Force sensitive
- How did Hondo's suicide attack work? Well she was Force sensitve (just ask Laura Dern)
- How did Finn survived being T-Boned by Rose's pod? He was Force sensitive
- How did Rose survive above high impact crash? She is Force sensitive

 

11 minutes ago, sauromosis said:

How about the fact that Finn and Rose are able to travel wherever they want and spend days doing it while the others are under severe threat and it only seems to last hours?

See above

  

[Ed Mack]

10 hours ago, Haay said:

People keep wrongly calling Star Wars "Sci-Fi" while it is Fantasy in Space. As such, it doesn't have to adhere to scientific principles. It's High Fantasy, set in a fantasy world with magic (the Force) and magic users / wizards (force sensitives). Some of the critique on TLJ comes from events in the movie not being physically possible (in our world, according to the physics of our universe). While it's easy to say that it is possible in the Star Wars (fantasy) universe.

Of course, even fantasy movies need to be internally consistent, and this is where TLJ fails. Because it tramples over the foundation established in earlier movies. It often happens when the movie creators think they can inject their own ideas into an already created and working world. Peter Jackson did the same thing with The Hobbit trilogy, deviating so far from the book and the Middle Earth foundation we loved in the Lord of the Rings movies, that The Hobbit movies were just not good. It also happened when the creators of the Game of Thrones TV-series overtook the books and had to start creating their own story lines. The difference in quality between Game of Thrones in the first few seasons and the last season is quite noticeable. 

I'm sure J.J. Abrams is pretty annoyed with some of the choices made by Rian Johnson, which he now has to work with for Episode 9. We'll see how that works out by end of next year.  

I think it just comes down to compelling main characters.  The LOTR had them...The Hobbit did not.  Even though Gandalf was in both and a strong character, he could not make up for the lackluster dwarves.  Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli were much more interesting.  Same with original STAR WARS crew.  Han Solo was cool.  Darth Vader was a bad ass.  A young Princess Leia was tough and cute.  Obi-Wan (Alec Guiness) was iconic.  In these new movies, the old crew was just that...old.  Besides Ridley, the new cast is annoying and forgettable.  

[exracer327]

20 hours ago, Ed Mack said:

I think it just comes down to compelling main characters.  The LOTR had them...The Hobbit did not.  Even though Gandalf was in both and a strong character, he could not make up for the lackluster dwarves.  Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli were much more interesting.  Same with original STAR WARS crew.  Han Solo was cool.  Darth Vader was a bad ass.  A young Princess Leia was tough and cute.  Obi-Wan (Alec Guiness) was iconic.  In these new movies, the old crew was just that...old.  Besides Ridley, the new cast is annoying and forgettable.  

That is a great point.  In fact, Lucas auditioned the original cast as an ensemble.  As the story goes, Harrison Ford was on set doing some carpentry work for Lucas and the original cast was short a "Han Solo" for a read through.  Ford did the best job out of anyone else who auditioned and ended up with the part.

That being said, we all grew up with the back stories for Vader, Han, Luke and Leia.  I mean, as a child I knew there was a cut scene in the original film with Jabba the Hutt and Boba Fett.  So there was continuity between what is now called #4-6.  This new crop of movies, they're just making stuff up as they go.  They're so busy tripping over themselves trying to create something that they aren't creating anything worthwhile.  I don't know.  As someone else said, we're probably all over thinking this.

I do now understand why Disney chose not to do the Timothy Zahn trilogy as their purpose was to kill off the original members to create something new.  Part of me wishes they had either recast the original roles and actually made movies from the Timothy Zahn trilogy or, if they felt it necessary to kill off the original cast, just start in the future with the opening scroll saying, "Luke, Leia, Han, and Chewie are all dead..."  Then they could have made Star Wars the story of R2-D2 and C-3PO, which have been in every major Star Wars movie, including Rogue One.  Do you suppose they'll make an appearance in Solo as well?  Should we start taking bets?  lol

[thegraverobber]

20 hours ago, Ed Mack said:

I think it just comes down to compelling main characters.  The LOTR had them...The Hobbit did not.  Even though Gandalf was in both and a strong character, he could not make up for the lackluster dwarves.  Aragorn, Legolas and Gimli were much more interesting.  Same with original STAR WARS crew.  Han Solo was cool.  Darth Vader was a bad ass.  A young Princess Leia was tough and cute.  Obi-Wan (Alec Guiness) was iconic.  In these new movies, the old crew was just that...old.  Besides Ridley, the new cast is annoying and forgettable.  

Uh, beg to differ. Kylo Ren/Ben Solo is by far the most compelling character since the OT (including Legends, television, and new canon).

[Sprocket77]

1 hour ago, thegraverobber said:

Uh, beg to differ. Kylo Ren/Ben Solo is by far the most compelling character since the OT (including Legends, television, and new canon).

Ah finally, proof that you have indeed been smoking some wacky tobacky, no other reason to come out with a statement like that.

[Vinetu]

1 hour ago, thegraverobber said:

Uh, beg to differ. Kylo Ren/Ben Solo is by far the most compelling character since the OT (including Legends, television, and new canon).

Sarcasm post of the year.

[KvHulk]

[Ed Mack]

3 hours ago, thegraverobber said:

Uh, beg to differ. Kylo Ren/Ben Solo is by far the most compelling character since the OT (including Legends, television, and new canon).

A shut down R2-D2 is a more compelling character than Kylo Ren/Ben Solo.

[Mathew]

Kylo Ren is interesting as a character and played well by Adam Driver. But I like him less after TLJ. Not Drivers fault though. 

[Ed Mack]

1 hour ago, Mathew said:

Kylo Ren is interesting as a character and played well by Adam Driver. But I like him less after TLJ. Not Drivers fault though. 

He's not the issue.  Neither is Rey.  The rest of the characters are so lame (besides Chewie).  While I was being somewhat facetious with my R2 comment, I think they definitely could have utilized R2 and C-3PO much more than they did.  A wasted opportunity in my opinion.  They never failed to deliver in the Original Trilogy.  

[thegraverobber]

1 hour ago, Ed Mack said:

He's not the issue.  Neither is Rey.  The rest of the characters are so lame (besides Chewie).  While I was being somewhat facetious with my R2 comment, I think they definitely could have utilized R2 and C-3PO much more than they did.  A wasted opportunity in my opinion.  They never failed to deliver in the Original Trilogy.  

I was responding to “Besides Ridley, the new cast is annoying and forgettable.”

Had you included Driver/Kylo in your initial statement, I probably wouldn’t have responded.

[Phil B]

How about some math to go with your TLJ?

https://www.wired.com/story/lets-use-star-wars-to-explain-the-concept-of-angular-size

[stackables]

3 hours ago, Ed Mack said:

He's not the issue.  Neither is Rey.  The rest of the characters are so lame (besides Chewie).  While I was being somewhat facetious with my R2 comment, I think they definitely could have utilized R2 and C-3PO much more than they did.  A wasted opportunity in my opinion.  They never failed to deliver in the Original Trilogy.  

Super bb-8 took up the droid screen time.  No time for r2 or c-3po, we had a casino scene to fit in. 

[Ed Mack]

13 hours ago, stackables said:

Super bb-8 took up the droid screen time.  No time for r2 or c-3po, we had a casino scene to fit in. 

Maybe that's the problem.  They have treated two of the most iconic STAR WARS characters of all time like set decorations, especially R2.  This is no knock on BB-8.  He was likable.  I think more screen time for the droids and less for Finn, Poe and the rest of the ho-hum characters would have worked better.  

[Jeff Mack]

26 minutes ago, Ed Mack said:

Maybe that's the problem.  They have treated two of the most iconic STAR WARS characters of all time like set decorations, especially R2.  This is no knock on BB-8.  He was likable.  I think more screen time for the droids and less for Finn, Poe and the rest of the ho-hum characters would have worked better.  

The value that R2 and 3PO had in the original trilogy (even 1-3) was crucial.  It's not like they are aged and it's like "oh the poor old robots" and they can't be used. Sure add BB-8, but again, so many lost opportunities.

[KShine]

George Lucas needs to share the original ideas he had for the storyline of the new trilogy movies (that ones that Disney rejected, leading to his being removed as a consultant).

His vision is the only one that should ever be considered true canon.

[Jeff Mack]

Lucas still owes us for that crap in the early 2000s.  I still think he made the crap up as he went a long

 

[thegraverobber]

4 minutes ago, KShine said:

George Lucas needs to share the original ideas he had for the storyline of the new trilogy movies (that ones that Disney rejected, leading to his being removed as a consultant).

His vision is the only one that should ever be considered true canon.

https://www.starwarsnewsnet.com/2018/01/pablo-hidalgo-sheds-more-light-on-george-lucass-influence-on-the-sequel-trilogy.html

Prequels come out: "George Lucas is ruining Star Wars!"

Sequels come out: "JJ Abrams/Rian Johnson are ruining Star Wars! Give it back to George Lucas!"

Nobody hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans.

[exciter1]

10 minutes ago, thegraverobber said:

https://www.starwarsnewsnet.com/2018/01/pablo-hidalgo-sheds-more-light-on-george-lucass-influence-on-the-sequel-trilogy.html

Prequels come out: "George Lucas is ruining Star Wars!"

Sequels come out: "JJ Abrams/Rian Johnson are ruining Star Wars! Give it back to George Lucas!"

Nobody hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans.

SWNN are kinda shills though, they have podcasts and Youtube revenue to preserve.  Same with Rebel Force Radio, then Paul Bateman, Kyle Newman, and F.J. Desanto go on there and totally rip TLJ. lol

[thegraverobber]

4 minutes ago, exciter1 said:

SWNN are kinda shills though, they have podcasts and Youtube revenue to preserve.  Same with Rebel Force Radio, then Paul Bateman, Kyle Newman, and F.J. Desanto go on there and totally rip TLJ. lol

Sort of irrelevant, I was just linking the first article I could find that contained Pablo's since-deleted tweets. Plenty of other sources.

[stackables]

1 hour ago, Ed Mack said:

Maybe that's the problem.  They have treated two of the most iconic STAR WARS characters of all time like set decorations, especially R2.  This is no knock on BB-8.  He was likable.  I think more screen time for the droids and less for Finn, Poe and the rest of the ho-hum characters would have worked better.  

Kill the past!!!  Just use the original cast to get people to see the film.  After we have them, they will be forced to love our new characters....or not.

[Will 4]

23 minutes ago, Jeff Mack said:

Lucas Made 3 great films which future Star wars films will never surpass in the early 2000s.

Fixed it for you

[Ed Mack]

52 minutes ago, thegraverobber said:

https://www.starwarsnewsnet.com/2018/01/pablo-hidalgo-sheds-more-light-on-george-lucass-influence-on-the-sequel-trilogy.html

Prequels come out: "George Lucas is ruining Star Wars!"

Sequels come out: "JJ Abrams/Rian Johnson are ruining Star Wars! Give it back to George Lucas!"

Nobody hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans.

The prequels were worse than the sequels.  Period....and George Lucas was responsible.  Maybe there should be a rule that no movie franchise exceeds 3 movies.