gregpj Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 LEGO is a wonderful toy to me and these often unnecessary gender discussions (always just focussing on female needs) when it comes to nowadays LEGO, which really is getting more and more rich in different characters, just feel so wrong to me and destroy a lot of that "magic" and neutrality of LEGO... that I cannot NOT voice my opinion against them sometimes! When the research institute game out I thought that it was a brilliant thing! Did you see men complaining: hey why isn't there at least one male researcher?! NO... There has never been a male research institute. Even though we have a lot of male characters in LEGO. And that's not a problem, because it's okay to have an only female research institute. If I want to I can take another minifig (a male one) and make it lead scientist (or not). Alrighty... full disclosure - my partner is a professor in sociology and has taught courses about gender equality amongst other topics, so my opinion and beliefs have some foundation of their own. Again, I appreciate the clarification... so I'll move the conversation along as you have. On the surface I agree with the statement that people are overly complicating the issue, but when you really get into the substance of their complaint, it has some merit. I've talked at length with a number of people about it and it really comes down to something much simpler. Stereotypes.... For many years LEGO sets just furthered gender stereotypes and "feminists" just asked for it to be more random. They never asked for "Friends" sets... they asked for a variety of colours, some that little girls might like more than little boys - not for entire sets based on those other colours.. They asked for female minifigures to be in construction sets or police sets - not sets based entirely on pretty little mini dolls. The reason they ask for something different is because they just want it to be a part of "normal" and it currently is not. Of course men don't complain about the RI set, we have the Ecto-1, Minecraft, Dr Who, etc... all strong male leads. Some people just take it way over the top when they complain and they get dismissed as "radical" or "crazy" and that's why I object to the term feminazi. At best it's controversial and at worst it's downright insulting. So let's restart, can you please refrain from using that term? Thanks, I appreciate it and I'll bet others around here will too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locutus001 Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 (edited) Concerning TMI: Sorry I didn't mean that to sound too offensive. But believe me having worked there I get a lot of (in my opinion) strange reactions from men and women alike... as if it's something disgusting. So I needed to say something here :-P Concerning the rest: We all have our sensitive topics, sorry if I annoyed you all with posting something when it came to mine... I'll try to refrain from using the term too often, maybe in this instance it was a little bit over the top... Also: Yes I also would have prefered an approach of including more colorful sets with more female characters instead of a whole new line (friends) that only focuses on girls and separates genders where there actually is no need thus only emphazising stereotypes...I'll go into hiding now ^.^ Edited June 6, 2015 by Locutus001 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locutus001 Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Sorry I didn't mean that to sound too offensive. But believe me having worked there I get a lot of (in my opinion) strange reactions from men and women alike... as if it's something disgusting. So I needed to say something here :-PWe all have our sensitive topics, sorry if I annoyed you all with posting something when it came to mine... I'll go into hiding now ^.^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzy_bricks Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 On the surface I agree with the statement that people are overly complicating the issue, but when you really get into the substance of their complaint, it has some merit. I've talked at length with a number of people about it and it really comes down to something much simpler. Stereotypes.... For many years LEGO sets just furthered gender stereotypes and "feminists" just asked for it to be more random. They never asked for "Friends" sets... they asked for a variety of colours, some that little girls might like more than little boys - not for entire sets based on those other colours.. They asked for female minifigures to be in construction sets or police sets - not sets based entirely on pretty little mini dolls.Would Lego have sold more "regular" sets if they just added female characters, or did they sell more because of the Friends line? We can speculate about that, but I'm guessing Lego did some market research. Regardless if you think it should be that way or not, it is the reality we're living in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregpj Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Would Lego have sold more "regular" sets if they just added female characters, or did they sell more because of the Friends line? We can speculate about that, but I'm guessing Lego did some market research. Regardless if you think it should be that way or not, it is the reality we're living in. Of course LEGO is a business... they're going to go the same route as everyone else and make girly LEGO since based on other company's success it would be better than just adding more female minifigs.I was just stating that it's not entirely fair to say some of these people with seemingly fanatical complaints, in my opinion, have legit beefs when their girly girl sets designed to be good for little girls have a male for a pilot. I think it's a bush league move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Raichu Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 On the surface I agree with the statement that people are overly complicating the issue, but when you really get into the substance of their complaint, it has some merit. I've talked at length with a number of people about it and it really comes down to something much simpler. Stereotypes.... For many years LEGO sets just furthered gender stereotypes and "feminists" just asked for it to be more random. They never asked for "Friends" sets... they asked for a variety of colours, some that little girls might like more than little boys - not for entire sets based on those other colours.. They asked for female minifigures to be in construction sets or police sets - not sets based entirely on pretty little mini dolls. The reason they ask for something different is because they just want it to be a part of "normal" and it currently is not. Of course men don't complain about the RI set, we have the Ecto-1, Minecraft, Dr Who, etc... all strong male leads. Bottom line, market dictates what LEGO is producing. LEGO would not have produced Friends sets 3 years in a row (gasp! longer than Chima) if those had not been selling so well. Friends line was not LEGO's first attempt to tap to the female/girl portion of the market. The previous attempts just never took off as well as Friends. Why ? Perhaps most girls in the targeted age groups just respond well to the minidolls and the color palettes. Perhaps the "feminists" who detest these minidolls so much are actually in the minority 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregpj Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Perhaps the "feminists" who detest these minidolls so much are actually in the minority No question... doesn't mean their opinions aren't valid and they deserve to be called names. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Raichu Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 (edited) Of course LEGO is a business... they're going to go the same route as everyone else and make girly LEGO since based on other company's success it would be better than just adding more female minifigs. I was just stating that it's not entirely fair to say some of these people with seemingly fanatical complaints, in my opinion, have legit beefs when their girly girl sets designed to be good for little girls have a male for a pilot. I think it's a bush league move. One thing to add, why would any female want to be a pilot at that crappy airline anyway ? Seriously, since when a pilot of airplane that size personally stows the passengers' luggage like he does ? ETA: Having said the above, the set is pretty open ended IMHO, despite the blurbs in the catalog / S@H website. Any child / end user could EASILY put the other female as the captain and the boy as the flight attendant. In the same vein, Stephanie could have piloted the plane, after all she flew her own plane in Heartlake Flying CLub set. Just like any other LEGO set, all you need is a dash of imagination Edited June 6, 2015 by Darth_Raichu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostDad Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Only a guess, but I would imagine lots of girls playing with these sets like to set up romances between the characters, which in most kids' minds probably requires some characters of each gender. The Friends theme sex ratio remains something like 9:1 anyway, and the female characters have all sorts of highly skilled occupations. Lego absolutely plays to gender stereotypes (the Friends' hometown is named Heartlake after all), and I can imagine a mom who's an engineer wanting to buy her daughter something like Research Institute instead. Still, if Friends gets more girls into legos at an early age, surely that's good for everyone. When the world of pink bricks and baby animals with ribbons in their fur gets old, they're always free to move on to $200 motorized technic sets... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locutus001 Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 When the world of pink bricks and baby animals with ribbons in their fur gets old, they're always free to move on to $200 motorized technic sets...Or the Death Star... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ciglione Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Or... Lone Ranger! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryherb Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Thats a dude? I thought they were lesbians Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mscheaf Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 She kind of has a point even though she flipped out. Why can't the pilot be a woman? With all the criticism LEGO has received about the girl characters only wanting to shop and be homemakers, how hard would it have been? I know, I know, most of you are men, and as men you haven't experienced sexism so it doesn't exist..... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryherb Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 She kind of has a point even though she flipped out. Why can't the pilot be a woman? With all the criticism LEGO has received about the girl characters only wanting to shop and be homemakers, how hard would it have been? I know, I know, most of you are men, and as men you haven't experienced sexism so it doesn't exist.....she can be a pilot but apparently in today's society she has to. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locutus001 Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Well she is sitting there in a pilot chair isn't she? I know, I know, most of you are men, and as men you haven't experienced sexism so it doesn't exist.....Exactly here you are wrong. Sexism is very often directed against men nowadays. she can be a pilot but apparently in today's society she has to.Exactly that's the point and mindset I don't like! We don't need to force people to be something they don't want to be because we think it's better for society.Airlines actually are trying to encourage women to become pilotes but (I'm not absolutely sure about the statistics) most just don't want to (understandably so!) so it's only about 10% female pilotes. (Living as a pilote pretty tough and I don't know if there are any brickpicker members who actually are pilotes. A friend of mine is one and I mean he's flying all the time... health risks aside it's not that easy to have a family and kids being a pilote. Especially many women don't want to endure that hardship. That's how we raise our children. Boys are raised more competitive and girls are raised more protected).This statistic given a male pilot is rather realistic but he can be a steward if he wants to! I mean both seem to fly this thing together and that's my point: Working together not against each other is the solution.Also I agree with GhostDads "romances" thingy... for a good conservative romance we need a male and a female character. My little sister doesn't even think about "ownership" that much... Her minifigures just play and enjoy life! I've never experienced her putting any focus on who actually owns the heart lake hotel or the cruiser or the bakery shop or the death star... it doesn't really matter to her I guess. And that's also one reason why I think it is unnecessary to criticise LEGO too much for their choice in putting a male pilote there. It could have been a female one! But it also can be a male one. That's how sex neutral toys are done... it can be both and it doesn't matter. My little sister doesn't care so much who is boss and has got which position, that's more something we aldults are fairing war for... because her one minifig likes to bake, her other minifig likes to eat and yet another one likes to fire the deathstar to keep off whoever wants to steal their cookies. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grynn Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Isn't YANBU that guy that is star lords sort of blue dad in guardians of the Galaxy?YONDU - You Ought Not Dance Unnaturally On-topic, is this woman also irate that the bellhop at the Heartlake Grand Hotel is male (Nate)? I hope so, because women can carry bags, too...What about Luis in Emma's House? Why does one parent have to be a man, for crying out loud??Seriously, there are more and more female pilots these days (most I've encountered being damned good ones), but it's far from "common".I think that promoting traditional gender roles / careers is fine for Lego as long as it is not the exclusive angle. And from a neurotic sampling of Friends set descriptions with the Male "dolls", I'd say it isn't, though it seems somewhat favored.Besides, the supposed "private jet pilot" Matthew has already been flown BY Mia in HER helicopter, and needs geography help from Stephanie (thank god for GPS and autopilot, right? ).On a similar note, Olivia's dad Peter is either a useless tool or really empowering his daughter since she is the one grilling AND mowing the lawn. Visit Olivia’s House with all of the LEGO® Friends! Olivia, her parents and her pet cat live in a big, bright house with lots of rooms for hanging out and having fun. Help Olivia to grill up a barbecue for the girls! Mow the lawn with the lawn mower. Take Olivia’s diary out of the drawer or go swing in the yard! Then, host a sleepover or have a party! Olivia’s House is built in sections for easy rearranging. Decorate, customize and rebuild it! Includes Olivia, Mom and Dad mini-doll figures.Includes 3 mini-doll figures: Olivia, Mom (Anna), Dad (Peter) and cat (Kitty) Set course for an ocean adventure on the Dolphin Cruiser with Mia, Maya and Andrew. Steer the boat with Andrew and take the girls for a spin around Lighthouse Island! (Heartlake News Van) Get Emma ready at the makeup table so she looks her best for the camera. Sit her at the news desk as Andrew films her talking about the cake story and then present the weather to the viewers. Head to Heartlake Shopping Mall for a girls’ day out! Stephanie and Emma are driving there in their new convertible for a fun day of fashion. Check out the sports shop and try on a dress in the bridal boutique. Then head to the food court for a slice of pizza before a well-earned relax in the spa with Sophie. Take some pictures in the photo booth before strutting down the catwalk in the charity fashion show while the DJ spins the decks, all to raise awareness for jungle animal rescue. Phew – what a day! Includes 4 mini-doll figures: Stephanie, Emma, Sophie and Julian (DJ), plus Emma’s dog, Lady Build and customize your dream family home with a modern edge! LEGO® Friends Emma’s House shows off all the creative skills of Emma’s family. Prepare a tasty meal in their state-of-the-art kitchen, using vegetables grown in their own garden and fresh ingredients from the opening fridge. Then sit the family down in the living room to watch a movie together on the flat-screen TV. Emma loves having her friends over to hang out in her bedroom, which she designed herself, and admire the view from herbalcony. Help her practice with her make-up in front of the big vanity mirror after a nice long bubble bath in the bathroom. Do some painting in the beautiful zen garden, which has a birdhouse for her pet bird, or host a barbecue with friends on the relaxing roof terrace. Combine with 41090 Olivia’s Garden Pool for even more fun in the garden. Includes 3 mini-doll figures: Emma, mom Charlotte and dad Luis, plus her pet bird. Have an exciting day at Heartlake High with Stephanie and Matthew. Ride Stephanie’s pretty blue bike to school! First, store her bag and her laptop in the locker, then head to science class and study plant cells under the microscope, experiment with chemical reactions using the beakers or look through the astronomy telescope. Be the star of biology class when Ms. Stevens calls you to the chalkboard to identify the different parts of the owl’s body! Help Matthew to point out the capital cities on the world map in geography class! Then Stephanie and Matthew wash their hands before lunch. Take some sandwiches and juice from the cafeteria and eat in the sun on the picnic table. Bring on the creative fun after lunch with art class and an easel, and then have music class with the guitar. After school, play basketball with Matthew or go for a bike ride! (Jungle Bridge Rescue) Help rescue a baby bear in trouble with Mia’s helicopter and Matthew’s offroader!Save the baby bear from the rickety old rope bridge! Rush Matthew to the scene in his offroader. Hover Mia’s helicopter over the bridge and winch down the stretcher to rescue the bear. Now lift him to safety and help Matthew check him over with his medical kit. Later, explore the cliffs with Mia and Matthew and see what treasures you can discover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryherb Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 (edited) ...on her quest of "i have nothing better to do with my life" she soon discovers 10224... oh my god! the groom is a man! ... Edited June 6, 2015 by jerryherb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryherb Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 ...On a similar note, Olivia's dad Peter is either a useless tool or really empowering his daughter since she is the one grilling AND mowing the lawn...reminds me of "that 70's show" when Red and Joanne clash Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Mack Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 I think this thread has run its course...time to move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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