Robb Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 You're an idiot.Explain? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pickleboy Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) Deleted...my apologies for engaging Edited May 21, 2015 by pickleboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robb Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) Let's start with telling someone who works with the US econ dev group for the US govt they have no idea what they are talking about. I am actually not going to push this any further b/c it has NOTHING to do with lego bricks or sets.But I will end with...you sir...are an asshat.I never said you don't know what you're talking about. You very well could be the greatest source of knowledge on this topic! You just don't want to engage people that you deem unworthy of your knowledge because of who they are and what there experiences are. I experience this all the time in my life, pompous peoples of experience that wont engage those that they deem unworthy of there knowledge. It breeds ignorance, if you "know" then develop your argument and enlighten. Stop diminishing people because they are not you, or ...ya know... maybe at all.I'll end with I hope you treat people better in the future and I hope you have a good night. Edited May 21, 2015 by Robb 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pickleboy Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) Deleted b/c this is stupid....I'm embarrassed I even engaged...Good luck sir. Edited May 21, 2015 by pickleboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robb Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) Here you go1 - Just curious if anyone here has first hand experience working on the front lines of economic development initiatives? I do... 2 - Still curious if anyone who has these strong position has any experience first hand with economic dev.3 - I have over a decade of experience so I am curious what others who actually have clue,4 - From my experience and from what I read here most of you should stop talking. 5 - Run a few businesses and then let's talk...6 - What experience do you have in creating jobs for others?7 - What experience do you have in economic dev?8 - I have sacrificed my income to fight for what I believe in9 - What have you done to help others?10 - I am egotistical when I talk about bringing people out of poverty ...I have done it...have you?11 - what experience do you have in economic development?12 - people who have real world experience13 - This is what I do for a living. 14 - When you have the same experience I have, we can call it ad hominem...15 - I asked if people had the same experience I do and then your tampon blew up ....16 - What do you do for a living so I can tell you how bad you suck at it?17 - someone who works with the US econ dev group for the US govt17! times you commented on who the giver or the receiver of an argument was! Good arguments don't care who they are from or who hears them. Good Arguments are good arguments out of anyone's mouth into anyone's ear. I hope you are a knowledgeable person that can help with this issue!(minimum wage, economic development) Please just stop trying to belittle engaged peoples of the wrong status to be engaged. Instead use a good argument to inform them of better information on the subject. Edited May 21, 2015 by Robb 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pickleboy Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 Fair enough...you are correct...I am wrong...Whatever it is you are arguing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robb Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 I'm arguing that you argue in a poor and mean manner. Just that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robb Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 I challenge you: without mentioning who you are, or who I am, make a persuasive argument about the subject at hand. The marriage one was good but not very fleshed out. like could you compare your marriage data to an economy that culturally views marriage very differently than the US? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KShine Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 There is no answer (within the current system) to the problems being discussed - since we all depend on that system nowadays just to survive.I do know that this entire thread should have been stopped once it started - It is nonsense to claim it is LEGO related whatsoever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Mack Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) LOL...OK...Wow, the thread lasted a day. Some good conversation, but it's getting a bit personal. No need for that. I don't have the answers, but I know raising the minimum wage nationwide will have some ramifications for all of us here in the US. Maybe more people will have access to LEGO sets, maybe more people will get involved in reselling, maybe less people will be parting out sets, maybe prices of LEGO sets will increase....maybe nothing happens. I am not smart enough to figure this all out.What I do know is that many small businesses will be hurt by such a practice and some people will get laid off because of it. I think what has been lost in all of this is the point of rewarding people for no reason. Owning several businesses for over 20 years, I have found that people get paid what they deserve. My assistant manager of the car wash came to the US 15 years ago with little money, skills or the ability to speak English, yet last week he just purchased his fourth house (3200 sq.ft) to go along with the other three he rents. He has two nice cars that are paid off and has raised three wonderful kids who excel in school. Basically he did this by working a minimum wage job and excelling at it..showing up on time, being reliable and trustworthy and working hard. No college education needed. He now makes over $60,000 a year from just doing the right things. On the flip side, I have hired and fired countless workers that were born here in the US with all the advantages of living in this country. They were not reliable. They did not show up for work. They had every excuse in the book why they didn't show up (one even said his father died when he didn't). They did poor jobs. Some were alcoholics. Some were drug addicts. Some had warrants that they never paid so they were arrested. I can go on. Point is, many of these fools would be the first to ask for more money. Why reward people for non-exceptional behavior? I appreciate the quality discussions of the last two days. I think it good to have some of this type of discussion on a forum such as this. Edited May 21, 2015 by Ed Mack 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biking_tiger Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) As a guidance counselor at a public middle/high school, I see all sorts of family structures. My district has a 50%+ free/reduced lunch program (meaning at least half our students identify at poverty level or below). Poverty, money, work ethic--it's not all one-size-fits all. This is the main reason I'm skeptical that simply raising minimum wage will fix anything.Mentoring helps (Ed, I'm sure your assistant manager had some good guidance along the way) and education helps. Educate about money... what it really is, how to spend it, why debt hurts, the dangers of credit. The best lessons I've learned in life are those about working hard, being the boss of my money, and taking care of other people.Someone mentioned the "teach a man to fish" analogy earlier. Throwing fish--or money--at a "problem" fixes nothing. As I tell the teachers at my school--"You have a college degree and a professional job--you might be the only successful adult our students have in their lives. Use that power wisely." Edited May 21, 2015 by biking_tiger 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biking_tiger Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 *and, just to say, I don't believe "success" as an adult requires a college degree. But it is a salient example of the kind of marathon which helps most people set and chase goals, develop work ethic, and preserver. Those are the character traits I want my kids to have.Breaking the cycle of poverty is a marathon. Not only is it longer than a sprint, but it takes planning and training and commitment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryherb Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 As a guidance counselor at a public middle/high school, I see all sorts of family structures. My district has a 50%+ free/reduced lunch program (meaning at least half our students identify at poverty level or below). Poverty, money, work ethic--it's not all one-size-fits all. This is the main reason I'm skeptical that simply raising minimum wage will fix anything. Mentoring helps (Ed, I'm sure your assistant manager had some good guidance along the way) and education helps. Educate about money... what it really is, how to spend it, why debt hurts, the dangers of credit. The best lessons I've learned in life are those about working hard, being the boss of my money, and taking care of other people. Someone mentioned the "teach a man to fish" analogy earlier. Throwing fish--or money--at a "problem" fixes nothing. As I tell the teachers at my school--"You have a college degree and a professional job--you might be the only successful adult our students have in their lives. Use that power wisely." well said. in the least accessible education is what US needs, perhaps instead of punishing small businesses with increasing the minimum wage for their low-ed entry level employees that money could be used for education. why are colleges so expensive here anyway? i cant understand the cost especially for its low level compared to so many other countries. i went to a private engineering school in the top ten (then). While it cost me an arm and a leg, i was taught the same things i learned in 8th grade where i came from. cant just keep putting a money bandaid on the issue, this needs to be fixed before it blows up in our faces. not that im not going to take my money and run before it does Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biking_tiger Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 well said. in the least accessible education is what US needs, perhaps instead of punishing small businesses with increasing the minimum wage for their low-ed entry level employees that money could be used for education. why are colleges so expensive here anyway? i cant understand the cost especially for its low level compared to so many other countries. i went to a private engineering school in the top ten (then). While it cost me an arm and a leg, i was taught the same things i learned in 8th grade where i came from. cant just keep putting a money bandaid on the issue, this needs to be fixed before it blows up in our faces. not that im not going to take my money and run before it does "Hyperinflation" A year at an in-state college costs now about the same for one year as I netted my first year as a teacher 17 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryherb Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 "Hyperinflation"A year at an in-state college costs now about the same for one year as I netted my first year as a teacher 17 years ago. that looks like an effect, not the cause. keeping the "prestige" sounds more like a reason, aka keeping poor from diluting their brand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justapilgrim Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 Pickle boy you are trolling Since you are probably an expert, let's hear what works Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exciter1 Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) well said. in the least accessible education is what US needs, perhaps instead of punishing small businesses with increasing the minimum wage for their low-ed entry level employees that money could be used for education. why are colleges so expensive here anyway? i cant understand the cost especially for its low level compared to so many other countries. i went to a private engineering school in the top ten (then). While it cost me an arm and a leg, i was taught the same things i learned in 8th grade where i came from. cant just keep putting a money bandaid on the issue, this needs to be fixed before it blows up in our faces. not that im not going to take my money and run before it does I agree that these colleges need less fancy buildings, prestigious sports programs, and artsy events and alternatively gear themselves toward more affordable education. Maybe this is what community colleges are supposed to offer and universities are for the more fortunate and scholarship privileged? The kids that do want a taste of university life have another option, go $150k-$200k in debt at the beginning of their career and pay it back for the next 10 years. Edited May 21, 2015 by exciter1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KShine Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 The current education system is actually doing its job - by limiting the skills of individuals which are required for the jobs that actually exist in our society.Leaders know that it is a lie, but will continue to preach about everyone getting a better education which will lead to better jobs.These jobs do not exist - someone needs to clean the toilets, and serve the fries (and we have lots of toilets, and really love our fries). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryherb Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) The current education system is actually doing its job - by limiting the skills of individuals which are required for the jobs that actually exist in our society.Leaders know that it is a lie, but will continue to preach about everyone getting a better education which will lead to better jobs.These jobs do not exist - someone needs to clean the toilets, and serve the fries (and we have lots of toilets, and really love our fries).... and hopefully wash their hands in between... though at minimum wage it may be too much to ask Edited May 21, 2015 by jerryherb 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biking_tiger Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 The current education system is actually doing its job - by limiting the skills of individuals which are required for the jobs that actually exist in our society.Leaders know that it is a lie, but will continue to preach about everyone getting a better education which will lead to better jobs.These jobs do not exist - someone needs to clean the toilets, and serve the fries (and we have lots of toilets, and really love our fries).When I "career counsel" my students, I always talk about jobs that require physical presence. If you have to be there to do the job, it can't be sent to a country with internet access and cheaper labor. Think of the premiums paid for plumbers, electricians, skilled carpenters, nurses, mechanics, etc... not everyone will want these jobs (work ethic is required as well as effort), but they are necessary and in demand. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Raichu Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 ... and hopefully wash their hands in between... though at minimum wage it may be too much to ask Oh c'mon, it is not an income thing. I have been to Headquarters of Fortune 500 companies where the employees did not visit any of their fancy sinks after they were done with their "businesses". Some people are just gross Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzy_bricks Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 When I "career counsel" my students, I always talk about jobs that require physical presence. If you have to be there to do the job, it can't be sent to a country with internet access and cheaper labor. Think of the premiums paid for plumbers, electricians, skilled carpenters, nurses, mechanics, etc... not everyone will want these jobs (work ethic is required as well as effort), but they are necessary and in demand. Mike Rowe, the guy from Dirty Jobs, has an excellent TED talk about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryherb Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 Oh c'mon, it is not an income thing. I have been to Headquarters of Fortune 500 companies where the employees did not visit any of their fancy sinks after they were done with their "businesses". Some people are just gross yeah, but did they serve you your fries and cheeseburgers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exciter1 Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 Oh c'mon, it is not an income thing. I have been to Headquarters of Fortune 500 companies where the employees did not visit any of their fancy sinks after they were done with their "businesses". Some people are just gross Man, don't even get me started there. If I see one of my employees leave the bathroom without washing, I immediately talk to them. It's not good for anyone. I hate it when I have to tell stories about being at restaurants and see one of the restaurant employees go straight from the stall to the door to the kitchen. That's happened to me at least twice. Unfortunately, the managers acted like they barely cared. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robb Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) Ok, now that things seem safe.2 things : as time has gone on the supply of humans has gone up and the demand for their labor has gone down. ; no matter the rules of society there will be a bottom and a top. All we can do is adjust the knobs to attempt to make the bottom a little less bad.here is something to think about, nearly everyone you've ever known is somewhere doing something. Their life is funded one way or another. Minimum wage may be the right knob to adjust to make more people self sufficient and it may not. It has in the past worked and failed. I think it has worked more often than failed, but over time the entire economy adjusts and we're back to where we started. technological advancement seems to be the only thing that consistently improves the bottom of humanity. Edited May 21, 2015 by Robb On iOS now the spell check often allows ridiculous things by. And I can spell at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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