makr Posted February 25, 2015 Author Share Posted February 25, 2015 So what am I missing?? $50 saving divided by $1000 cost is 5% Saving 5% means you'll only have to pay 95%, not 95.24%. If someone offers you a 10% discount on a $20.000 car, you would expect having to pay $18.000 (disregarding all the sleazy car dealer tactics). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregpj Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 This is way to complicated for me. I just log what I pay at the time for a set. I see no reason to go through all that when it all comes out even in the end anyway. That was kind of my point. I do exactly the same thing... I earn the points when I earn them and spend them when I spend them. I bought a DO over the weekend with points.. it was free. I could care less that I didn't get VIP points, it was free! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Brickowski Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Just a recent thought: VIP points save 100%-100%/1.05 = 4.76%, not 5%. Not that it matters much, but might be interesting for those of you who (like me) factor in VIP points in purchasing prices. Other factors that I don't consider: no interest rate on points (loss will be lower the earlier the points are being used) chance for overhanging points end up never being used (increased revenue decreases percentual loss) making less lucrative purchasing decissions because of points etc. First of all no one ever said that VIP points are a discount. So your basic assumption itself is already wrong, because you are talking about "saving" money. Lego speaks of a reward: "Earn 1 VIP Point for every $1 you spend online or at the LEGO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lego rules Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 (edited) Saving 5% means you'll only have to pay 95%, not 95.24%. If someone offers you a 10% discount on a $20.000 car, you would expect having to pay $18.000 (disregarding all the sleazy car dealer tactics). yes, you are correct. I was looking at from a VIP points is cash point of view. If you spent $1000 on lego and received a 5% on that it would be $50 in VIP points. If you could get cash for those VIP points your cost would be $950 for $1000 worth of lego which is the 95% of bought value. With VIP points, you don't earn VIP points on VIP points so for that same $1000 you get $50 in VIP points but no VIP points for the $50 or any VIP points for subsequent purchases. So if you did get VIP points on VIP points used you would receive $50 * .05 = $2.5 in VIP for the $50 VIP purchase. When you use the $2.5 in VIP you would receive $0.125 in VIP points.....etc etc to ******. So now you have gotten $1000 + $50 + $2.5 + $0.125....+ ****** worth of Lego for $1000 which is 95% Now that we have overcomplicated this whole thing! Edited February 25, 2015 by lego rules Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seal Cutter Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 If you analyse your investments based on profit/time, you just made your investment worse reading this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bricketycricket Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Apparently I am in the minority in that in my spreadsheet I like to factor the VIP points into the cost of the set that awarded the points. I know that seems completely wrong, but the point of the spreadsheet for me is to be able to look back on which sets were the most effective investments, when they were purchased, was it during double VIP, etc. and having some sets suddenly appear as great investments simply due to points being cashed in is not helpful. I think it's more useful to be able to look at the sheet and see "OK, my best investments were large sets from theme X and were purchased during winter double VIP points". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryherb Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 (edited) most lego sets are priced at xxx.99. you only get the xxx VIPs. the .99 actually falls off the table, so no, you do not get full 5% cashback. you get your VIPs per item as well, not the total on your bill. if all you buy are minifigs you just lost 25% of your VIPs, which brings you to 3.75% cashback, not 5%. look at your VIP history. on the other hand i totalled 98k+ points since i opened my account, DAMN! Edited February 25, 2015 by jerryherb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ciglione Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 (edited) I do the same... I substract the points when I use them. Like a credit. Edited February 25, 2015 by Ciglione 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
makr Posted February 25, 2015 Author Share Posted February 25, 2015 First of all no one ever said that VIP points are a discount. So your basic assumption itself is already wrong, because you are talking about "saving" money. Lego speaks of a reward: "Earn 1 VIP Point for every $1 you spend online or at the LEGO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
makr Posted February 25, 2015 Author Share Posted February 25, 2015 With VIP points, you don't earn VIP points on VIP points so for that same $1000 you get $50 in VIP points but no VIP points for the $50 or any VIP points for subsequent purchases. Yes that's the point I was trying to make 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Brickowski Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 I really don't know what we're talking about or what assumption of mine is supposed to be wrong. All I said was that VIP points aren't a 5% saving/discount/difference between what you pay in case A and case B. You are the only one who is talking about VIP points as a discount. That is your wrong basic assumption. Who else but you said it was a discount and not a reward? You started the topic and that was your statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogmios Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Apparently I am in the minority in that in my spreadsheet I like to factor the VIP points into the cost of the set that awarded the points. I know that seems completely wrong, but the point of the spreadsheet for me is to be able to look back on which sets were the most effective investments, when they were purchased, was it during double VIP, etc. and having some sets suddenly appear as great investments simply due to points being cashed in is not helpful. I think it's more useful to be able to look at the sheet and see "OK, my best investments were large sets from theme X and were purchased during winter double VIP points". I was going to do the same thing, but then after thinking about this further, I decided that it was the wrong approach since I am not getting money back or discount really. I am getting a credit for further purchases. The 5% only has any value if used in later time. Also, if you use the 5% as "discount" at purchase time, you will be forced to enter the cash value for sets that you purchase later on. Your way is not necessarily wrong at all, but not really reflective of reality, since you actually did not "save" the 5% during initial purchases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bricketycricket Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 I was going to do the same thing, but then after thinking about this further, I decided that it was the wrong approach since I am not getting money back or discount really. I am getting a credit for further purchases. The 5% only has any value if used in later time. Also, if you use the 5% as "discount" at purchase time, you will be forced to enter the cash value for sets that you purchase later on. Your way is not necessarily wrong at all, but not really reflective of reality, since you actually did not "save" the 5% during initial purchases. I agree, it doesn't make logical sense to apply the discount to the set that earns the points, because it is not truly a discount. However, I do it anyway because I find that it makes my data collection more useful to me since, for example, a $200 exclusive purchased during double VIP is not equal to a $200 exclusive purchased at other times or from other retailers with no rewards system, and I want that reflected in my numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locutus001 Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 To me it's 5% discount. If there is a 100 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
makr Posted February 25, 2015 Author Share Posted February 25, 2015 You are the only one who is talking about VIP points as a discount. That is your wrong basic assumption. Who else but you said it was a discount and not a reward? You started the topic and that was your statement. I said VIP points save you less than 5%, almost literally. Are you contesting that I said that or the truthfulness of that statement? Or do you want to say that you don't save anything through points but rather just get something on top? If that's the case, can we at least agree that in the long run, you'll end up paying less through points for the same thing than without points? I'll probably still end up calling that saving, but don't intend to force that term upon anyone. Call it pay lessies or whatever, I don't mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lego rules Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Discount or rewards system. I thought it was a true 5% savings which it is not, and enjoyed solving why it is not 5%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KShine Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 (edited) Don't really know what's the real "point" of this thread though... maybe one day I'll read everything and not just skim through it and have a new view on LEGO and the universe. Please don't do it - This may be the most "point"less thread I have ever read. It could serve as a reminder for anyone who is ever getting worked up over a thread - People can/will go at it over just about anything (or nothing), so there's really no need to ever take it too seriously. By the way, the next time I am freaking out - please remind me. Edited February 26, 2015 by KShine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Mack Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 My head exploded. I feel like Ben Affleck in Good Will Hunting. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ravenb99 Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 A lot of analysis over some points... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sroster Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 My head exploded. I feel like Ben Affleck in Good Will Hunting. Footage of Ed Mack in Brickpicker.com negotiations: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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