STAR WARS VII - "The Force Awakens" - Movie Discussion

[thoroakenfelder]

47 minutes ago, thekragle said:

Ren is using the jedi mind trick before she even knew what the jedi mind trick was.....

Luke too old

Anakin too old

Ren ... picks up the force like a cold. (may be it was the lightsaber transfer? - midoclorians (spelling -5) again.

Ben Kenobi: Remember, a Jedi can feel the Force flowing through him.

Luke Skywalker: You mean it controls your actions?

Kenobi: Partially, but it also obeys your commands.

I would say that apart from creating Anakin from nothing, this is another time that the Force directly influenced someone. Besides, how do you think the original force users got to a point where they could use the force without someone to teach them?

[BrickLegacy]

Not sure what thread to post this in....mild spoiler below.

 

 

My theory is that Rey's memories and Jedi skills are suppressed.  This is most likely from a traumatic event in her childhood.  She had some Jedi training at some point; she is too skilled to be new to the force. Ren awakens it and she immediately regains the power she once had.  There is a connection between the two and that moment of interrogation brought it all back to the surface.  It remains to be seen what that connection is. I can't wait to watch it again. 

[dcurve]

9 minutes ago, BrickLegacy said:

My theory is that Rey's memories and Jedi skills are suppressed.  This is most likely from a traumatic event in her childhood.  She had some Jedi training at some point; she is too skilled to be new to the force. Ren awakens it and she immediately regains the power she once had.  There is a connection between the two and that moment of interrogation brought it all back to the surface.  It remains to be seen what that connection is. I can't wait to watch it again. 

Agreed. There seems to be something going on there. The flashbacks and the lightsaber calling to her were signals of something more substantial there ....

[California92563]

17 minutes ago, Alpinemaps said:

Hux is the son of an Imperial general. It took the remnants an entire general (maybe even 2?) to regroup and start appearing as a threat to the New Republic.

Grand admiral Thrawn did all of the work......  

Edited December 23, 2015 by California92563

[jaisonline]

2 hours ago, Darth_Raichu said:

Losing his padawans broke Luke like losing the Jedi council broke Yoda

Not to nitpick but Yoda lost the entire Jedi Order : Temple, Knights, Padawans, Younglings, their archives, that old "know it all" librarian.  It broke him just as losing his nephew (and who knows how many other trainees, etc...).

Note: I mainly blame Mace Windo for losing the Jedi Order. He was too cocky and never liked / trusted that Skywalker kid. 

[chipbee]

51 minutes ago, Bold-Arrow said:

Anymore DS type of weapons and I'm walking out .. No joke . And this has been asked before, but how will the first order regroup quickly ?? One could ( should ?) assume that their top commanders and engineers are no more . 

Also get rid of millennium falcon, x wing, tie fighter, star destroyer, light saber etc. No more of force, dark side, light side, jedi, sith, blasters, storm troopers. And i dont want to hear about hyperdrive, lightspeed, space, planets, rebel, resistance, empire, imperial. I want everything new and fresh ideas only.

This movie is such a let down, rehashing everything 

[California92563]

6 minutes ago, dcurve said:

Agreed. There seems to be something going on there. The flashbacks and the lightsaber calling to her were signals of something more substantial there ....

I agree as well, she totally outmatched Kylo mentally and physically so there's definitely something there. When I saw the movie I was honestly surprised that Luke wasn't hiding on starkiller base, I figured it would be one of those "hiding in plain sight" moments and I figured he would be the one that grabs his oldlightsaber out of the snow instead of Rey and try to talk/ calm down Kylo since he's wiser than we could possibly imagine by now 

[jaisonline]

Some of you might want to read the two main books that start to fill in the gaps between films 3 & 4. Each begin to explains how the Empire was evolving after the DS 2 debacle, looks like Snoke might be in it, Vader artifacts begin getting collected, etc... Start with Aftermath and then that young adult one. Many sites do have summaries of each book. 

[California92563]

6 minutes ago, chipbee said:

Also get rid of millennium falcon, x wing, tie fighter, star destroyer, light saber etc. No more of force, dark side, light side, jedi, sith, blasters, storm troopers. And i dont want to hear about hyperdrive, lightspeed, space, planets, rebel, resistance, empire, imperial. I want everything new and fresh ideas only.

This movie is such a let down, rehashing everything 

I see that you didn't mention midichlorian's

[chipbee]

8 minutes ago, California92563 said:

I see that you didn't mention midichlorian's

This is probably the only credit i will give to JJ Abrams for not mentioning a single word on midichlorian. Otheriwse i am absolutely devastated with wholesale rehash of everything from episode 4 to 6.

This movie is so bad that i think JJ stands from Jar Jar Abrams. 

Now i have eat my meds. Chat later.

[exciter1]

12 minutes ago, chipbee said:

This is probably the only credit i will give to JJ Abrams for not mentioning a single word on midichlorian. Otheriwse i am absolutely devastated with wholesale rehash of everything from episode 4 to 6.

This movie is so bad that i think JJ stands from Jar Jar Abrams. 

Now i have eat my meds. Chat later.

I appreciate the passion in your hate.

[California92563]

21 minutes ago, chipbee said:

This is probably the only credit i will give to JJ Abrams for not mentioning a single word on midichlorian. Otheriwse i am absolutely devastated with wholesale rehash of everything from episode 4 to 6.

This movie is so bad that i think JJ stands from Jar Jar Abrams. 

Now i have eat my meds. Chat later.

 

13 minutes ago, exciter1 said:

I appreciate the passion in your hate.

[templesweeper]

23 hours ago, jaisonline said:

Some of you might want to read the two main books that start to fill in the gaps between films 3 & 4. Each begin to explains how the Empire was evolving after the DS 2 debacle, looks like Snoke might be in it, Vader artifacts begin getting collected, etc... Start with Aftermath and then that young adult one. Many sites do have summaries of each book. 

I was not a fan of Aftermath.  It's an OK book at best, and I pretty much read everything Star Wars.  Lost Stars, on the other hand, was really well done.  It's considered a young adult novel, but don't let that scare you away.  And it explains why there are all those crashed Star Destroyers on Jakku.  It has two great Star Wars characters.  If you really want to read Aftermath, maybe try the audiobook.  I really found Wendig's writing style to be jarring.  I will read the cliff notes of the sequel.

[Bold-Arrow]

1 hour ago, chipbee said:

Also get rid of millennium falcon, x wing, tie fighter, star destroyer, light saber etc. No more of force, dark side, light side, jedi, sith, blasters, storm troopers. And i dont want to hear about hyperdrive, lightspeed, space, planets, rebel, resistance, empire, imperial. I want everything new and fresh ideas only.

This movie is such a let down, rehashing everything 

Ummmm , like any of this is remotely close to what I was trying to say 

[Darth_Raichu]

2 hours ago, jaisonline said:

Some of you might want to read the two main books that start to fill in the gaps between films 3 & 4. Each begin to explains how the Empire was evolving after the DS 2 debacle, looks like Snoke might be in it, Vader artifacts begin getting collected, etc... Start with Aftermath and then that young adult one. Many sites do have summaries of each book. 

 

Hmm, if I need to read the books to understand the plotlines, I will have to knock a few stars off TFA.  A good movie should not need outside materials to explain itself.

 

2 hours ago, jaisonline said:

Not to nitpick but Yoda lost the entire Jedi Order : Temple, Knights, Padawans, Younglings, their archives, that old "know it all" librarian.  It broke him just as losing his nephew (and who knows how many other trainees, etc...).

Note: I mainly blame Mace Windo for losing the Jedi Order. He was too cocky and never liked / trusted that Skywalker kid. 

You were correct, I meant Jedi order not council.  For Luke, his padawans were his new Jedi order

[exciter1]

10 minutes ago, Darth_Raichu said:

You were correct, I meant Jedi order not council.  For Luke, his padawans were his new Jedi order

I know you meant padawan?

[Darth_Raichu]

3 hours ago, BrickLegacy said:

My theory is that Rey's memories and Jedi skills are suppressed.  This is most likely from a traumatic event in her childhood.  She had some Jedi training at some point; she is too skilled to be new to the force. Ren awakens it and she immediately regains the power she once had.  There is a connection between the two and that moment of interrogation brought it all back to the surface.  It remains to be seen what that connection is. I can't wait to watch it again. 

Or, maybe Snoke created Rey from concentration of midichlorians.  Rey and her mom were supposed to stay in a desert planet until a traveling Jedi (Luke?) finds her and picks her up.  Except that here mom was forcefully taken away from Rey when she was younger.  So Rey was supposed to wait for her mom (fat chance) or a Jedi to find her. 
ETA: this explains Rey's force prowess as she was supposed to be Anakin 2.0

See, I can put a twist on a rehashed story too...

[thoroakenfelder]

1 hour ago, templesweeper said:

I was not a fan of Aftermath.  It's an OK book at best, and I pretty much read everything Star Wars.  Lost Stars, on the other hand, was really well done.  It's considered a young adult novel, but don't let that scare you away.  And it explains why there are all those crashed Star Destroyers on Jakku.  It has two great Star Wars characters.  If you really want to read Aftermath, maybe try the audiobook.  I really found Wendig's writing style to be jarring.  I will read the cliff notes of the sequel.

I didn't like how these 2 characters that we've never heard of were around for every significant event in the OT.

[Darth_Raichu]

7 minutes ago, exciter1 said:

I know you meant padawan?

Didn't Han mention Luke had a group of students ?

[templesweeper]

40 minutes ago, Darth_Raichu said:

Hmm, if I need to read the books to understand the plotlines, I will have to knock a few stars off TFA.  A good movie should not need outside materials to explain itself.

 

You were correct, I meant Jedi order not council.  For Luke, his padawans were his new Jedi order

You don't need to read the books.  It's all just filler that doesn't really give you that much more info.  The only really important thing in Aftermath that I would say that helps set up the world is that Mon Mothma wanted to demilitarize the New Republic, which is why it was so easy for the First Order to destroy the New Republic's ENTIRE fleet all at once in the Force Awakens.  Leaia is basically leading the black ops group (resistance) on her own.  

[Cbenioff]

6 hours ago, chipbee said:

so was many tyrants like Hitler, Kim Jong Un, Cheney etc.

Keep politics off here. This is a dispicable post.

[thekragle]

The more I keep thinking of this movie the more holes I keep finding. Return of the jedi brought the entire cast together.. Luke is now a Jedi, Han and Leia are together, and the bulk of the empire has been destroyed. I watched the Star Wars, Empire, and Return in order over the weekend to prepare me for this next movie. I had hoped tidbits from Luke's conversations with Yoda and Ben would be prevalent and even possibly what this movie was to be about. The force is strong in Luke's family - show Luke training luke and leia's kids, Hate leads to the darkside - have Luke become Kylo Ren do to something awful happening (like father like son), and possibly play with Luke's visions he saw on Dagobah - Luke's face in vader helmet (Luke becomes Kylo Renish) or when Luke sees his friends suffering in the clouds... change it to not be Cloud City but a new place in a new film. (where Han can croak)... heck make Han's death the thing that turns Luke to hate the first order ... and go to the darkside.

Overall it is an okay movie and I understand why it was made by Disney. They shake off the George Lucas shackles and start new.

I did enjoy Reys performance and it's great she will be around. She made the movie.

PS: Also a clone emperor showing up would have kicked butt... and have Ian McDiarmid reprise the role once more. (To find out the emperor cloned himself before ROTJ would have tied all of the star wars movies together)

Edited December 23, 2015 by thekragle

[jaisonline]

7 hours ago, Darth_Raichu said:

Didn't Han mention Luke had a group of students ?

“Rey spoke while drinking in the details of the marvelous but imperfect chart. “Why’d he leave, anyway?”
Han pursed his lips; thinking back, remembering.
“He was training a new generation of Jedi. There was no one else left to do it, so he took the burden on himself. Everything was going good, until one boy, an apprentice, turned against him and destroyed it all. Everything”

Excerpt From: Alan Dean Foster. “The Force Awakens (Star Wars).” Del Rey, 2015-12-18. iBooks. 
This material may be protected by copyright.

Check out this book on the iBooks Store: https://itun.es/us/s5l26.l

[jaisonline]

7 hours ago, templesweeper said:

You don't need to read the books.  It's all just filler that doesn't really give you that much more info.  The only really important thing in Aftermath that I would say that helps set up the world is that Mon Mothma wanted to demilitarize the New Republic, which is why it was so easy for the First Order to destroy the New Republic's ENTIRE fleet all at once in the Force Awakens.  Leaia is basically leading the black ops group (resistance) on her own.  

Basically, dead on.  Plus the empire started to regroup and reorg into the New Order. Someone was pulling the strings as the Moffs weren't in-charge. Some links..

http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/09/04/9-important-new-details-from-star-wars-aftermath

http://www.denofgeek.us/books-comics/star-wars/248987/star-wars-11-things-aftermath-introduces-to-the-expanded-universe

http://io9.gizmodo.com/everything-we-know-about-star-wars-post-return-of-the-j-1729549100

 

 

[templesweeper]

11 hours ago, thekragle said:

The more I keep thinking of this movie the more holes I keep finding. Return of the jedi brought the entire cast together.. Luke is now a Jedi, Han and Leia are together, and the bulk of the empire has been destroyed. I watched the Star Wars, Empire, and Return in order over the weekend to prepare me for this next movie. I had hoped tidbits from Luke's conversations with Yoda and Ben would be prevalent and even possibly what this movie was to be about. The force is strong in Luke's family - show Luke training luke and leia's kids, Hate leads to the darkside - have Luke become Kylo Ren do to something awful happening (like father like son), and possibly play with Luke's visions he saw on Dagobah - Luke's face in vader helmet (Luke becomes Kylo Renish) or when Luke sees his friends suffering in the clouds... change it to not be Cloud City but a new place in a new film. (where Han can croak)... heck make Han's death the thing that turns Luke to hate the first order ... and go to the darkside.

Overall it is an okay movie and I understand why it was made by Disney. They shake off the George Lucas shackles and start new.

I did enjoy Reys performance and it's great she will be around. She made the movie.

PS: Also a clone emperor showing up would have kicked butt... and have Ian McDiarmid reprise the role once more. (To find out the emperor cloned himself before ROTJ would have tied all of the star wars movies together)

Firstly, it sounds like most of your problems with the film were what you THOUGHT it should be, not what it actually is.  That is a common problem for people when they see a hyped up film for the first time.  You're not alone.  To address some of your points, there was no way they could show Luke training Han and Leia's kid(s) since so much time has passed.  Kylo Ren is already kind of young (early 20's in terms of the actor) so to make it believable, those had to be events in the past. 

There was no way they would make Luke turn all evil.  That would COMPLETELY negate the struggle at the end of Return of the Jedi when he says to the Emperor, "I'll never turn to the dark side."  He passed his test, move on.

There's no way I wanted a clone emperor.  Firstly, he wouldn't LOOK the same.  His deformed image wasn't something that would transfer to a clone. 

There is an interesting theory out there that Rey is Luke's clone.